# messages

type: message
date: 2022-11-29 16:11:44
content:
  Add token to MetaMask
  Open the MetaMask extension in your web browser.
  Select the Assets tab.
  Scroll down and click Import tokens.
  Select the Custom Token tab.
  Insert the contract address of the token to the field Token Contract Address. ...
  Click Add Custom Token. ...
  Click Import Tokens.


type: message
date: 2022-11-29 16:20:29
content:
  Might have to message Karel directly and hope they answer, considering the transactions are handled manually by him. Last I recall this is the address used for sending NCR out https://etherscan.io/tokentxns?a=0xf87725a4592ebfce1c83a8145cfd38c285228e27 which says the last NCR withdrawal was 21 days ago. *I don't have official word that this is the known address, it just has been assumed to be the withdrawal one in the past based on its history*


type: message
date: 2022-11-30 14:05:18
content:
  truly hope so , i'm still mad at myself for investing a to large portion of my portfolio in NCR because of greed , offcourse completely on me and noting to do with the neos VR team .


type: message
date: 2022-11-30 15:46:51
edit_date: 2022-11-30 18:46:39
content:
  I prefer to support a platform by actually using it and building the infrastructure within. Funding only takes you so far.


type: message
date: 2022-12-01 11:25:49
content:
  That is full of unsubstantiated rumors and myths and has no sources, which we've already discussed many times here before.


type: message
date: 2022-12-01 11:26:47
content:
  I can't prevent you from doing so but I'd encourage you to think about sources and how easily myths can propagate.


type: message
date: 2022-12-02 20:14:04
content:
  No team shares news during a bear market.
  You have to take advantage of the hype of the bull market.


type: message
date: 2022-12-02 20:24:34
edit_date: 2022-12-04 01:26:56
content:
  I've seen both of the sides contribute and both of them mess up. Which is why i can't choose any sides. And it will stay that way until I see some ACTUAL activity or discussion from the team including Karel.


type: message
date: 2022-12-02 20:30:34
content:
  Then that's your choice. I can't side with anyone. Just really disappointed as i feel like my creations were a waste in some ways because i thought neos would be more future proof than vrchat.


type: message
date: 2022-12-02 20:32:07
content:
  And that's how it is. Because if the servers are shut down for Neos and VRChat at the same time, you cannot use VRChat any more, but you can still use Neos and connect with people and still create stuff together


type: message
date: 2022-12-02 20:34:26
content:
  But you have to remember. Neos has a centralized cloud. And if that goes under. Worlds can't be loaded and inventories won't work


type: message
date: 2022-12-02 20:35:24
content:
  local worlds are also your inventory, in the case the cloud would be no more. Items can be carried over from world to world


type: message
date: 2022-12-02 20:36:32
content:
  And this is just a guess, but I would think, before Neos is shut down, that a huge amount of its code might be placed in the open source to not kill it off


type: message
date: 2022-12-02 20:38:55
content:
  dubious
  neos will run.. sorta
  but there are other cloud stuffs, all your dashboard, any cloud vars, contacts..


type: message
date: 2022-12-02 20:42:04
content:
  Even though its said that Neos being single-threaded is a myth, and yes, it is technically multi-threaded with workers in a way, a lot of the important things is still in a single thread


type: message
date: 2022-12-02 20:43:01
edit_date: 2022-12-02 20:43:49
content:
  Turning a gaming engine that is based on Entity-Component to actually make use of all cores, I think is not impossible, just very hard to do


type: message
date: 2022-12-02 20:50:19
edit_date: 2022-12-02 20:50:54
content:
  If being pedantic in a specific way, we already have multi-threaded LogiX. Because LogiX runs in parallel concurrently with one thread per User


type: message
date: 2022-12-02 20:54:50
content:
  Regarding the cloud storage, I'd need to spend time with it, but even that I feel is a solvable issue... to an extent


type: message
date: 2022-12-02 20:55:56
content:
  not that it can do much about world storage, however. For object storage, I think Neos is compatible with HTTP, so you could just store things the old fashioned way and call it from your own storage


type: message
date: 2022-12-02 21:00:52
content:
  That being said, my 5 cents on the previous discussion if everything goes up, I'm unsure what I'd specifically do. I guess I could go back to my previous platform... except I can't since it's gone. Only choice after that would be one of its forks, which would be ironic considering the desire for an open source system that some people want here. Would mean a stronger starting point, since most of my code from previous would carry over, and most resources from Neos I have already works there.


type: message
date: 2022-12-02 21:01:39
content:
  However, I would miss the tools Neos has since, frankly speaking, they're more refined. Recreating would be possible, but it'd be a case of "Why am I reinventing the wheel a millionth time?"


type: message
date: 2022-12-02 21:06:19
content:
  likewise here, but I have backup plans that should allow me to keep 90% of the functions with minimal compromises


type: message
date: 2022-12-03 09:33:04
content:
  yeah Neos has hardcoded neosdb links for the shaders, and an in built whitelist to make sure custom shaders aren't used


type: message
date: 2022-12-03 09:35:00
content:
  Actually, the whitelist might also be in the cloud. However the local database could be initialized with the whitelist, as it looks like it is cached in there


type: message
date: 2022-12-03 09:36:43
content:
  welp, tried to fix some issue with the SteamDeck setup and didn't quite succeed. Was nice to get into that stuff though, so will look at another issue later


type: message
date: 2022-12-05 20:54:25
edit_date: 2022-12-05 21:53:12
content:
  Lol. I don't know if you've noticed yet, but most (not all) of neos' core, active user base kind of couldn't care less about ncr right now. Nor did they in the past, before the pump/dumb happened


type: message
date: 2022-12-06 15:39:36
content:
  my general viewing is one cannot build a nuclear power plant without first having the made the concept of a lightbulb. At this time, there is no foundation for a system to stand on, and attempting to empower it will only prove everything to be as hollow


type: message
date: 2022-12-06 17:02:17
content:
  that'd be pretty interesting to see. I recall an older project involving on-site oil drilling and using the platform as a training system for both safety and operation, since screwing up the process could cost a massive amount, but screwing up a virtual setup costs nothing


type: message
date: 2022-12-06 19:01:48
content:
  I'm going to have to use a VPN to look up schematics though, otherwise someone's gonna think I'm a crazy person


type: message
date: 2022-12-06 19:03:03
content:
  if someone tries to use a secure connection to look up schematics of nuclear plants, might look strange^^


type: message
date: 2022-12-07 04:29:52
edit_date: 2022-12-07 05:28:44
content:
  That's all correct if you want to build rooms that feel natural. Lookup the building codes in your jurisdictions for door heights and widths. then just make sure those are in meters and you'll be good to go.


type: message
date: 2022-12-07 08:05:36
content:
  if I'm not mistaken, you can also get Blender to also build in metric, resulting in the two playing more nicely (I mean, besides the fact you can just bring in blender files natively)


type: message
date: 2022-12-07 08:07:26
content:
  Blender by default is in metric but users usually select "auto" when importing so that it doesn't end up lining up.

  Additionally exporting models in to various formats can affect the scale.

  If you can get all of those issues resolved instead of select auto scale you select "meters" and everything works correctly. 

  However if you've forgotten one step or used the slightly wrong export options in blender then you end up with city sized models or atom sized models.


type: message
date: 2022-12-07 08:11:15
content:
  yeah. I can't remember what the default is. It's either cm or m. I remember dabbling with this when I was recreating items from measurements I had


type: message
date: 2022-12-07 21:48:46
content:
  some things like 3d printer slicers will assume a model is in cm though blender units are actually meters


type: message
date: 2022-12-08 05:27:27
edit_date: 2022-12-08 05:27:32
content:
  Not really an announcement, more like a comment on how he would like crypto to be handled in the future. This has also been said wayyyy long ago a few times before.


type: message
date: 2022-12-08 13:33:25
content:
  I wouldn't imply motives, personality, behavior and differences from two sentences so pixelated I could barely make it out. 😂


type: message
date: 2022-12-08 14:22:25
content:
  i love ncr, i got it from mmc and basically it is free storage space
  running right up to the 5gb i have though x(


type: message
date: 2022-12-08 15:14:54
content:
  eh. It's just storage tokens for me. only ever tried one cash out and that was a disaster. Lost quite a bit, but what I have left is fine for me


type: message
date: 2022-12-08 17:11:33
content:
  yes, updated at the end of each month
  if you have ncr already then you can also  exchange ncr in neos for storage


type: message
date: 2022-12-08 17:34:22
content:
  Well, the other thing to remember is that Patreon NCR isn't the same as exchange NCR, in that the Patreon one isn't even a token, but rather contributes to your balance on the account. In that case, you don't have fees involved.


type: message
date: 2022-12-08 21:15:02
content:
  Hi👋🏼 
  I hope I'm not breaking the rules of your community when I write to the group . Could you please tell me who is responsible for the cooperation in this project?


type: message
date: 2022-12-11 00:20:48
content:
  I have. Granted it was a while ago. But also I wrote this up for anyone who was looking to get storage for cheaper than the patreon: https://discord.com/channels/402159838827905024/996964315145961542/1037967917985316954


type: message
date: 2022-12-11 12:45:06
content:
  Hi all, guys, how are you? Maybe you can help me with something. I am working on a presentation on all the wrong predictions the press made about the internet in the '90s. If you remember any article with similar tone, could you please forward it to me? You can write at info@simonepuorto.com


type: message
date: 2022-12-13 18:01:31
content:
  Hi all, I created a page with all the major players in the metaverse space: https://www.travelsingularity.com/metaverse
  If you have any suggestion for other companies, articles, podcasts, books, etc. or if you want your company, article, podcast, book, etc to be listed, please drop me a message at info@simonepuorto.com and I will review it!


type: message
date: 2022-12-15 19:35:00
content:
  *shrugs*
  Back when I used to do mining for learning experiences, this would be around the time I moved everything into the garage for natural cooling.


type: message
date: 2022-12-15 19:39:06
content:
  that's what VR was for: GPU was basically the heater, to the point where I had to actively cool the room off, even during the winter. I partially blame a terrible thermostat


type: message
date: 2022-12-15 20:10:00
content:
  for me, the sensors just have inconclusive information. The rooms with the most heat generated, at all times, is my office room and my media room, but I did set them up to retain temps better so...


type: message
date: 2022-12-15 20:10:33
content:
  however, the thermostat is located in the dining room, which is the most volatile room, so any temp changes results in changes for the whole house, even if the rooms with occupation don't need it


type: message
date: 2022-12-15 21:12:23
content:
  in some mirror of similar concept, I've debated putting my PC in the closet to reduce noise and for better thermal control, but at the same noation, it'd also mean I can move my desk out for more space


type: message
date: 2022-12-15 22:56:57
content:
  speaking of, reminded  me to sign into my SteamDeck to renew my sign in there, and my cloud world's reflective surfaces plays super nice with it still.


type: message
date: 2022-12-16 02:12:50
content:
  VR Chat Announced Udon 2 With Support For Collections Why Does Not Logix Have This Yet https://ask.vrchat.com/t/developer-update-15-december-2022/15518


type: message
date: 2022-12-16 02:16:44
content:
  I mean, to some regard, Neos does have that with slots that can have variables in it that are addressable by address. So it's less C# and more C++ in that regard.


type: message
date: 2022-12-16 02:18:29
content:
  though it'd be neat to have like a dedicated logix node for that kind of stuff, kidn of like a dynamic multiplexer that has event drivable function calls for popping, pushing, and what not.


type: message
date: 2022-12-16 02:20:39
content:
  but, bear in mind that Neos hasn't seen an update for well over a year, while other platforms have had the luxury of continued service maintenance. In some regard, it's still interesting that Neos runs with the flexibility that it has despite the lack of anything new


type: message
date: 2022-12-16 03:55:29
content:
  I mean, making a basic list system would basically be the VR equal of my old Intro to C++ courses decade ago


type: message
date: 2022-12-16 03:56:42
content:
  I mean, people made Tetris in Shenzhen I/O, and that game is basically a microcontroller assembly language simulator with basic circuits


type: message
date: 2022-12-16 04:00:58
content:
  as previously stated, a native solution WOULD be nice, but until updates are back underway (which, I need to once again point out, only NOW does VRC have the function...  a full year AFTER Neos stopped getting updates), it's a case of you'll have to make it yourself or have someone else work on it


type: message
date: 2022-12-16 04:02:30
content:
  I'm still disappointed in how vrc handled mods.. and the eac kernel level spyware that will delete your files if someone at vrc happens to dislike you


type: message
date: 2022-12-16 04:03:50
content:
  could be worse: could have Elon buy VRC and promise everything will remain free, then wait for how long that promise lasts


type: message
date: 2022-12-16 17:43:54
content:
  I don't understand the collectively embarrassing level of hatred for Elon Musk, and I probably never will. Man completely disrupted the entire space transportation industry, the entire automotive industry, the entire payment processing industry, now he's biting into social media. If people don't like how he shakes things up, it's not exactly a poor reflection on him. He's improving the standard by which many things are done, even if ill-conceived initially. We will have to see how it works out on his newest endeavors, but I have significantly more confidence in his ability to succeed than his detractors.


type: message
date: 2022-12-16 21:01:40
content:
  basically that. Like, don't get me wrong: I I can't say that his earlier actions before acquiring the social platform really was entertaining to observe, simply because it felt the dream some people have of being able to absolutely troll a larger corporation with actual effect was being made real. However, all they had to do was stick to their original promises and intended goals, and honestly, that hasn't happened.


type: message
date: 2022-12-16 21:01:58
content:
  Actions speak louder than words, and their actions not only are louder, but also go completely against their own words.


type: message
date: 2022-12-17 13:57:45
content:
  There are big problems with cryptocurrencies. For example, btc cannot pay dividends. The assets must bring interest. btc these chickens will not lay eggs. There is also the fact that even btc is a currency many economics professors from prestigious universities don't understand. Cryptocurrencies need to build offline communities (churches) like a Catholic-like religion, to strengthen the identity of the first users. There is a need for organized outreach to spread cryptocurrency. Believers need to communicate with each other. They use cryptocurrencies to buy services and goods from each other and provide each other with application scenarios. Cryptocurrencies subsidize offline activities with online proceeds


type: message
date: 2022-12-17 16:10:04
content:
  The problem is I can say that a dozen eggs is about $2 for farm fresh variety. I can write it up on a sign and be assured the $2 is still $2. Inflation or the change in value of an egg doesn't change the value of the dollar.
  Now lets try BTC, ETH, or DOGE. 12,000 Satoshi (or 120 uBTC), 0.0017 ETH, or about 26 DOGE. Ignoring gas or miner fees, that's the value as of right now. However, the next day or even a few hours, maybe the eggs are now worth 125 uBTC because now the value of uBTC related to the dollar has changed, or transaction fees have gone up. The primary issue is you cannot live entirely on something so volatile and not backed by anything major. I cannot reliably sell eggs for a digital coin.


type: message
date: 2022-12-17 16:57:28
content:
  1, the essence of money is just credit, fiat money is just a government-backed currency, one of many
  2, the issuance of money should be free competition, anyone can be issued in the market as the general equivalent of money, with their own credit as an endorsement. Success or failure, as long as you can be honest beforehand and fulfill the contract afterwards, that is the moral currency


type: message
date: 2022-12-17 16:59:31
content:
  3, Given that fiat currencies are constantly over-issued, the exchange rate between digital currencies represented by Bitcoin and national fiat currencies is bound to keep rising
  4, essentially, this is a digital currency to replace the fiat currency on the global wealth of the price process, that is, the process of redistribution of global wealth. This process, until the dollar becomes waste paper, to stop


type: message
date: 2022-12-17 17:31:14
edit_date: 2022-12-17 17:35:18
content:
  Many economics professors from prestigious universities don't understand how fiat works either. Also have no idea why this conversation started. Morning everyone!


type: message
date: 2022-12-17 18:04:14
edit_date: 2022-12-17 18:08:15
content:
  Cryptocurrencies how they are of today fall behind in competition, due to being volatile and they cannot be used to pay your taxes, or there is no demand and value in cryptocurrency


type: message
date: 2022-12-17 18:05:29
content:
  There are only a few cryptocurrencies that I know that have intrinsic value, which is usually the main currency of a blockchain that is to pay transaction fees


type: message
date: 2022-12-17 18:13:09
content:
  I don't doubt that, actually. However some history might help in understanding one of the concepts of how fiat works. It involved a kingdom, soldiers and taxes. Someone else might be better at explaining how that works


type: message
date: 2022-12-17 18:17:42
content:
  additionally, and this goes for basically everything, is ease of use. Let's be real: crypto isn't exactly user friendly, even if you unironically let an exchange manage your wallet (and thus, defeating the whole point of a decentralized digital currency). Remember how there used to be butt of jokes with older people who still paid with checks? Nowadays, that same concept now goes with sliding credit cards over the superior wireless payment options or just using your phone ala GPay, ApplePay, or WhotheheckcaresPay. It might be a generational situation, but until you have people who actually are using the newer tech as an actual form of exchange, it also kind of defeats the point.
  Unless someone can simplify those credit chips made many years back. Those were really neat.


type: message
date: 2022-12-18 05:23:45
edit_date: 2022-12-18 05:34:47
content:
  Well. To be fair, he did absolutely none of that, but he did buy companies that did and then proceeded to tank their value by being terminally online and quick to get into petty fights with anyone who didn't buy into his real life tony stark mythology.

  Launching a car into space was a cool gimmick though.


type: message
date: 2022-12-18 14:38:17
content:
  NCR looks to be a little less than 0.11$ at the moment (According to in-game, Uniswap, Crypto.com) and no new announcements here or in discord related to it recently


type: message
date: 2022-12-18 22:16:27
content:
  yup... though I'm pretty good on storage for now. It's mostly exclusive for just helping friends of newer people who need a bit more


type: message
date: 2022-12-19 23:16:08
content:
  Thats the thing. The NCR coin is an utility coin, that was meant to give something to sponsors of neos, that they can show/trade as a token of gratitude. To be part of the success of the project, as they probably get more valuable if neos is successful^^


type: message
date: 2022-12-20 02:09:28
content:
  I feel part of the issue was having it be tradable outside of neos out of the gate.  This made people speculate on it based on it being a token and less of it being a reward for the people actually backing and using it. It became just another token rather than being the platform's premium coin that showed value because of its origin.


type: message
date: 2022-12-20 04:25:25
edit_date: 2022-12-20 05:39:33
content:
  I think maybe a little note/reminder here will be helpful to keep the discussion rational ☺️.

  Going back to history and referring to the current whitepaper - yes, one of the purposes of NCR was to be used within the Neos community as a token of “gratitude” (I am quite fond of that expression actually☺️) so tipping creators for instance, as well as to recognize and reward those who are making valuable contributions to the platform. It’s why CDF was designed in the first place. The founders and the team wanted of course to encourage more people to get involved in the development and growth of Neos. Seems like in a galaxy far far away, I know, but I think we can agree that the vision for NCR was - and still is, very different from all these 21.000 other “s**t coin” projects that some of you are referring to. 

  It was supposed to be a slow and steady growth that rewards long-term holders - so not designed for speculation, but rather for very practical reasons. And going steady, of course eventually NCR would allow for much wider economic activity - such as integration with planned Neos Store, Neos Jobs, and all activities described in the whitepaper.

  Now. For a token, any token or tradable asset, NCR, or whatnot, it is important to remember that the value is ultimately determined by the demand for it. That seems very obvious but we tend to forget.
  So in order to increase liquidity and value, it is not uncommon for utility tokens similar to NCR to be traded on crypto exchanges - there are simply more buyers and sellers available there, not just the imminent (and rather small) audience that is actively using the platform.  

  However, in practice, that demand is heavily influenced by a variety of factors - one of them being community sentiment. Which for Neos and NCR was one big kaboom.😅 We do not need to go into all the painful reminders, but we are where we are largely because of it. 

  There are of course other ways to increase value and add stability beyond trading on exchanges - simply increasing usage within the platform, some healthy strategic partnerships, regular updates, new features, fostering open community etc etc. You can see how most of it is very problematic for Neos right now. 
  So we are all doing the best we can given the situation we are in. 

  We understand that those who are still left and care, are feeling frustrated and anxious. 
  Yes, silence can be deafening but everyone is working quietly behind the scenes and we will have updates to share with you soon. I think the next year will be at very least, interesting 😉.


type: message
date: 2022-12-20 04:31:00
content:
  Staking promise in 2022 first quarter and still no delivery. How community supposed to trust when you promise result next year???


type: message
date: 2022-12-20 04:31:04
content:
  I'm not sure I can concur. Neos had its spike, it's largest activity and usage of the platform this very year, in no thanks to a certain other platform's actions leading people to come out of concern. The value of NCR has only dwindled, and never increased in relation to usages.


type: message
date: 2022-12-20 04:34:15
content:
  I wish I could concur with that; it'd give meaning to the hardships of the users who reside on it and have had the most belief in the system.
  Silence isn't deafening; it's suffocating...


type: message
date: 2022-12-20 04:36:48
content:
  I do not "promise" anything. I am only stating that next year will be interesting for Neos. Please re-read the message to avoid some misunderstandings or mis-quotations☺️


type: message
date: 2022-12-20 04:39:02
content:
  I say things because staking promised. And still no delivery. You say things happen next year and no reason for community to trust.


type: message
date: 2022-12-20 04:40:10
content:
  When you mention the spike are you referring to the sudden surge of users who came to us from VR Chat?


type: message
date: 2022-12-20 04:41:18
content:
  This is correct. From usage charts alone, the wave of new users lasted quite awhile and the impact of it is still current, with the average users being visibly higher since.


type: message
date: 2022-12-20 04:50:01
content:
  Yes I see your point, but I think most of them perhaps came because they saw Neos as the only alternative available after the modding ban and such? Not necessarily because of their support for the vision and Neos platform etc. 
  So that wouldn’t necessarily help to fix the damaged reputation caused by the dispute etc. and foster a better community spirit that’s needed, as it was more a lucky random event😁. Even tho it lasted for a while yes. 

  I’m taking purely hypothetically here and of course I could be wrong, or you may disagree, in which case I’m happy to listen people’s reasoning☺️.


type: message
date: 2022-12-20 05:12:49
edit_date: 2022-12-20 05:13:46
content:
  true that it is most
  any user could choose to go back; that is what majority did
  but some of those people did stay, after all for many it is the first foot in the door
  it's good that neos is more known to a wider community even if briefly


type: message
date: 2022-12-22 19:48:52
content:
  yeah. it varies per exchange. 0.1089 is very high, with the mode I'm seeing usually around 0.107 and the lowest being 0.106. And there are exchanges who round up to the nearest penny, or $0.11.


type: message
date: 2022-12-22 19:51:57
content:
  at best, I could 'maybe' 1k NCR at the higher value exchange rate? Depends on how you want to receive the payment. Stuff like that would be best carried on DM


type: message
date: 2022-12-22 19:55:18
edit_date: 2022-12-22 20:15:54
content:
  Anyone interested in buying mine at 4,5$ , like to get rid of them, i'll even do it for 4$ a piece 😂


type: message
date: 2022-12-22 19:59:23
content:
  At most 10 cents currently, if there was demand for that. I cannot see demand for NCR except for maybe storage space


type: message
date: 2022-12-22 20:24:44
content:
  No 10 cents!
  Without making fun of you.
  I'm really sorry for what happened to you. 
  But I would keep the nrc.
  This is a bad time to sell it.
  But if you have no other choice....


type: message
date: 2022-12-24 02:21:44
content:
  I mean, I bought more storage, but that wasn't with the tradable token but rather the in-world currency


type: message
date: 2022-12-24 21:34:23
content:
  not really. Basically, there are kind of two kinds of NCR: the in-world balance, which isn't subject to gas fees and can be exchanged with no delay between users, and the token version, which requires the whole usual deal of needing a wallet and dealing with fees if you plan to move it at all


type: message
date: 2022-12-24 21:36:09
content:
  so, the issue is that most people in Neos's system (i.e. its users) have an extra amount of NCR that isn't exposed on the usual market that other people deal with, and is easier to deal with. You can transfer between the two states, but that of course comes with the faults of the wallet based version in both directions.


type: message
date: 2022-12-24 21:36:38
content:
  of course, when it comes to a utility token having... utility, only the in-world NCR has any actual use


type: message
date: 2022-12-25 02:49:23
edit_date: 2022-12-25 03:42:01
content:
  Merry Christmas to all of our Neos users and Telegram community!🎄🎅⛄️ May this holiday season bring you joy, happiness, and lots of love. 
  Wishing you all the best and looking forward to a bright and prosperous new year!


type: message
date: 2022-12-27 10:24:09
content:
  One of Milo's enablers turns out to be highly placed among employers like Second Life's Linden Labs, and is a crypto investor trying to take over a user created game mostly used by furries. https://twitter.com/NazifurReceipts/status/1536715368261029888?t=9vC3fA0zLvJmlGyYDMTpIg&s=19


type: message
date: 2022-12-27 16:43:13
content:
  Combination of things. Was pushed to high to quickly, not enough players to sustain that and then the fight of the two owners. It basicly came crashing down as a result of everything colliding


type: message
date: 2022-12-27 16:43:44
edit_date: 2022-12-27 16:44:07
content:
  Now the only thing really missing is one of the two owners finally getting sole control so that this can have a future.


type: message
date: 2022-12-27 19:04:33
content:
  it went lower? Oof. Guess I shouldn't have purchased that in-world amount last week.
  (that's sarcasm if it isn't obvious)


type: message
date: 2022-12-27 20:33:50
content:
  eh. I don't care as much. I have like 0.05 BTC that I could get back, but with all the tax work to deal with and all that, I'm just letting it burn. Same goes for a few other things. So a change in NCR value like that doesn't really phase me as much


type: message
date: 2022-12-27 21:05:53
content:
  If you have questions, complaints or comments about bans please submit a ticket to moderation.neos.com


type: message
date: 2022-12-28 10:55:18
content:
  I’m in Prague where I have been for months. My wife is from and has family in Portugal thats why we sometimes go there. Not sure why that is public information or who made it public but it’s not about holidays. That’s the last thing on my mind rn.


type: message
date: 2022-12-28 10:57:05
content:
  As for NCR price being so low as it is, that is to be expected with macro this low and the very bad look the dev strike brought in term of future development pace expectations.


type: message
date: 2022-12-28 10:57:48
content:
  We have to demonstrate things are moving forward and that Neos is well alive to get the price to ATH and beyond.


type: message
date: 2022-12-28 14:42:44
edit_date: 2022-12-28 14:43:30
content:
  All projects dealing with crypto are rather quiet in terms of announcements in this market phase. This may be the reason. 
  Ranting about a team is easy when you're sitting in the stands and just watching the game.


type: message
date: 2022-12-28 15:20:27
content:
  Is there any possibility the neosvr team just put the project on hold because of crypto bearmarket? Nothing to gain now and if market get bullisch and team moves forward again it would give sentiment around NCR a super boost?
  Or is this just wishful thinking?


type: message
date: 2022-12-28 15:32:46
content:
  No, based on the announcements that have been posted so far that is not the reason. It also has been 'on hold' for like a year now


type: message
date: 2022-12-28 16:08:23
content:
  Equally curious with that one, given that lately I have been doing a large amount of exchanging in-world with other users. Haven't received any notifications or disclosures about a deadline to send confirmation of how much to stake, if at all. This is especially critical if the in-world balances are then to be sent to the chain, which would require exact time and trade value for 1040D


type: message
date: 2022-12-29 05:30:18
content:
  Trademarks are highly specific too. A cheese trade mark for vacuum cleaners may coexist with a cheese trade mark for medical technology


type: message
date: 2022-12-31 15:15:49
edit_date: 2022-12-31 15:40:18
content:
  Happy New Year all🎆. Much love, health & happiness in 2023, celebrate responsibly 😁 and wishing you a fantastic year ahead!☺️


type: message
date: 2022-12-31 15:41:58
edit_date: 2022-12-31 15:55:53
content:
  Happy New Year everyone, wish you all a lot of success and happiness all year long. Can’t wait for all the great things 2023 will bring. 🎆


type: message
date: 2023-01-02 02:27:16
content:
  you can read pinned messages here or the discord's announcement section for updates. If there are no new updates here or there then please don't say "but there's no up to date information" The most up to date information is in those locations.


type: message
date: 2023-01-04 05:32:44
content:
  Hmm.... food for thought: back with the older platform I was on, they formed a partnership with Digital Ocean to provide easier to start up servers for users to have their own worlds, much like pre-configured servers for webhosting and gaming.
  So, given that the only way to access the headless server software is currently via Steam with a key provided from the Patreon, have there been thoughts that, in the future, possible similar partnerships could be established?


type: message
date: 2023-01-04 10:33:02
content:
  A few docker containers do exist for spinning up headless servers but they do require a little bit of setup like any headless might for what neos account, world, permissions, and anything else in the headless config file. They also do require you have the beta key for it to be able to do anything. The main missing part there I would be a user friendly front end to doing that config bit


type: message
date: 2023-01-04 10:34:29
content:
  Somehow I remember some web UI projects regarding that front, but heck if I can remember where I saw them.
  But yeah, I figured it'd also be a bit of an odd situation, given that headless servers are more optional, given that the client can already do everything thanks to the peer to peer systems.


type: message
date: 2023-01-04 10:38:10
content:
  The main part making that difficult or any other hosting service difficult is actually communicating with the headless reliably


type: message
date: 2023-01-04 10:42:41
content:
  for me, headless servers help solve issues where people's connections are good enough to join, but not to host (thank you, modern ISPs). Additionally, persistence is also pretty nice, though it does lead to 'who left the dev tools everywhere' arguments like it's a college dorm.


type: message
date: 2023-01-04 10:50:27
content:
  that and I could see some neat utility of 'mini' headless clients. Like if it had access the audio devices, things like controlling virtual assistances (like GAssistant) could be made more doable.


type: message
date: 2023-01-04 10:51:48
content:
  Heck, hook up a 360 webcam, use it to create a streamable skybox, and put the mini server outside with some solar power to create a virtual observatory. Sure, you 'could' stream it back to a bigger server, but there's an extra wow factor in that the tiny unit is doing all the work.


type: message
date: 2023-01-04 13:15:30
content:
  even without having a separate system to host, a separate headless process is isolated from the user crashing or lagging on its main thread which is pretty useful


type: message
date: 2023-01-04 18:45:09
content:
  I think the only way any kind of roadmap can exist is after all the current issues are resolved. It's like planning a roadtrip when the van is still impounded.


type: message
date: 2023-01-04 18:46:44
edit_date: 2023-01-13 19:27:01
content:
  let us just wait another year with no news just to make sure the emotions are down and the dev team is ready for cooperation


type: message
date: 2023-01-04 22:39:37
content:
  It's still sadly ironic that most people seem to keep speculating on the system... despite never once diving in themselves.
  Oh well, more virtual flat screen TVs for me.


type: message
date: 2023-01-05 07:10:12
content:
  My friends sent to hello@neos.com but no one returns in 2021-2022, Did neos come back to return about commercial emails?


type: message
date: 2023-01-05 16:08:25
edit_date: 2023-01-05 16:11:10
content:
  Karel does a portion of the patreon still being put forward to push the mint ? as no updates have been given on that front as in how far in the batches are we or no update ?


type: message
date: 2023-01-05 17:45:10
content:
  I quite like this confidence of Karel. My mentor was like this when he was younger, he was smarter than elon musk and forced himself to read more than 2.5 hours a day for a long time


type: message
date: 2023-01-05 21:33:19
content:
  Also, I think you mean portion of the mint is going into Patreon rewards. What you said sounded like money from the Patreon was going to minting


type: message
date: 2023-01-05 22:20:45
content:
  Patreon is used to pay for the servers that host your content and make neos work plus other operational costs such as email, domain names etc.

  It does not fund development though.


type: message
date: 2023-01-05 22:21:29
content:
  i believe all funds through that patreon are handed by karel..
  one of the incentives is ncr, through minting


type: message
date: 2023-01-05 22:22:51
content:
  That isn't directly what they asked. When this question comes up its important to state that while it doesn't currently fund development it does fund a lot of the stuff that is needed to keep Neos operational.


type: message
date: 2023-01-05 22:24:20
content:
  Not going to lie, I hate the crypto part of it, and it would be a significant reason to drop patreon.


type: message
date: 2023-01-05 22:36:55
content:
  I understand, our discord is more friendly in that regard. I don't control the rules here though so I am informing you of the status quo.


type: message
date: 2023-01-06 01:40:48
content:
  I mean, at this point, that's the only use it has. Given the numbers, where the number of users for it is high but the income for it is still the same, it sounds like mostly everyone is just getting the $1 tier because 5GB cloud storage is the true winner.


type: message
date: 2023-01-06 03:36:31
content:
  This was discussed in the past: you can opt out of the rewards. Even then, unless you want the headless server, the lower tiers do not give NCR.


type: message
date: 2023-01-06 03:38:53
content:
  you CAN obviously transfer ncr out or in, but if you are not interested in that, its a pure ingame currency to you


type: message
date: 2023-01-07 01:53:28
content:
  Hey, you can read pinned messages here or the discord's announcement section for updates. If there are no new updates here or there then please don't say "but there's no up to date information" The most up to date information is in those locations.


type: message
date: 2023-01-07 13:48:11
edit_date: 2023-01-07 13:52:54
content:
  just here to ask the crypto people some questions if you all still look at this chat. what would you want in a Neos plugin if possible for crypto features as currently i'm playing around with some ideas https://imgur.com/gyMQNDl with a etherscan and a opensea node


type: message
date: 2023-01-07 17:49:22
content:
  Proper confidentiality for API keys and protection of LogiX nodes, so they cannot be invoked by other players but yourself


type: message
date: 2023-01-07 18:09:27
content:
  the nodes currently im doing have keys in them *shrug* though will have a fallback to use own api keys might store them in field as ***** but need to figure that out


type: message
date: 2023-01-07 22:37:31
content:
  Hmm... not really a crypto person, but I'm assuming some kind of 'permission' ID would have to exist, sort of like the websocket/http access dialog that pops up, but I'm guessing that's what the various event triggers there are for, like 'requested transaction,' 'requested outcome,' and 'transaction outcome' or whatever


type: message
date: 2023-01-07 22:39:02
content:
  but I guess it also depends on what they want in part of the outcome... like should the rate of the currency be exposed or handled as a seperate node?


type: message
date: 2023-01-07 22:39:34
content:
  Very interested to hear what people have to say... if anything at all, since most of what I've seen is people caring about value and less about function


type: message
date: 2023-01-08 05:43:01
content:
  Looking at the on-chain data, nft is far ahead of ft. It looks like the future is in nft, but no smart people have explored applications for nft yet. nft has yet to emerge as an application like defi.


type: message
date: 2023-01-08 07:29:39
content:
  I'm guessing it's doing some strange logix to verify that stuff, since the system by default doesn't have such API calls to my knowledge


type: message
date: 2023-01-08 08:48:13
content:
  Opensea requires a api key i don't have and the ether scan is being annoying currently working on it but right now we have a working coin gecko node https://imgur.com/h6R4nim


type: message
date: 2023-01-08 09:09:52
content:
  Also less about real value. It seems that any "value" is liked, as long as it is to the moon. So even inflated price by selling NFTs to each other. As long as price goes up, even if there is no value.


type: message
date: 2023-01-08 09:18:11
content:
  Value is fictitious and relative. Value comes from the belief of a community.
  What is money worth if no one believes in it?


type: message
date: 2023-01-08 22:26:37
content:
  Theoretically, debt can be exchanged for something of equal value.  But people have currently agreed on the fiat money because this brings some advantages.
  Fiat can also be replaced when something better comes along.


type: message
date: 2023-01-09 04:39:26
content:
  NFT, metaverse, web3.0 ...... In the last two years or so, we have seen a whole bunch of big words full of
  big words flying around. Everyone is talking about these things, but no one can give a clear definition. This is not surprising. The final definition of each newly created big word depends on the experience of its life cycle, not on the arbitrariness of the big word's inventor. Because every big word is a living organism, it also needs a growth process similar to the breaking of a chrysalis or a plumage. In this process, we can choose to stand by and watch. But we can also choose to participate.


type: message
date: 2023-01-09 07:02:01
edit_date: 2023-01-09 08:55:38
content:
  Sewage Fruitz is a collection of 2,500 upgradable NFTs created from the depths of the Ethereum Blockchain and a reward to all members of the Cryptex Finance community. A fungus, grown out of dark substances in the yard of Mushroom Man as he spreads his spores worldwide.Holding a Sewage Fruitz PFP unlocks user ability to go on quests within the Cryptex Finance ecosystem, completing tasks that will be unlocked inside the DAO. Sewage Fruitz holders can earn upgrades and badges by completing these quests. Users can burn these upgrades in the future based on their achievements and earn CTX, the Cryptex Finance protocol governance token available worldwide on Coinbase, Gemini, Huobi, and many others.


type: message
date: 2023-01-09 08:42:36
content:
  Sounds like the worst of nft's and mining combined. But its not only energy that is wasted, but also millions of life-hours


type: message
date: 2023-01-09 10:08:58
content:
  I didnt do anything wrong, I didnt even say anything there. I just joined and you guys banned me. :(


type: message
date: 2023-01-09 10:09:33
content:
  I'm a NEOS Pro user and I also have an Alternative account that I pay Gunter Patreon for every month.


type: message
date: 2023-01-09 10:11:40
content:
  I'm just trying to build a business and uplift the community by bridging the gap between Unlockable Content and Amazing VR experiences.


type: message
date: 2023-01-09 14:18:53
content:
  As everyone that knows anything about the project: it depends all on the ceo and main programmer finally splitting up and get the project going again


type: message
date: 2023-01-09 14:23:59
content:
  i think its fairly desktop friendly
  you can ctrl click on nodes (or any other uix) to enter a ui aligned camera view


type: message
date: 2023-01-09 14:27:44
content:
  yeah.. like for variables, almost any field with a value is a "variable" that you can read from
  unless it's a dynvar the concept of scope is weak
  then for writing, you'll impulse to a write, or  use drives


type: message
date: 2023-01-09 14:29:11
content:
  Yes, but specifically design wise. Make an object that generates rays and animation and one that sets a property called lifepoints on a parent avatar


type: message
date: 2023-01-09 14:30:28
content:
  but still logix is very similar to lines of code, there are so many similarities even though it's all different


type: message
date: 2023-01-09 14:30:38
content:
  Raycaster is a gun and the watcher checks on hits by that raycast and reduces from property lifepoints


type: message
date: 2023-01-09 14:34:00
content:
  The way that this program works now is way easier to test. You dont need hundrets if interactions. Only two objects from your inventory


type: message
date: 2023-01-09 14:34:28
content:
  there are several generic weapons and health systems already though so maybe you will focus on the building :p


type: message
date: 2023-01-09 21:12:11
edit_date: 2023-01-10 02:28:00
content:
  Only Neos, yes. It's systems and concepts are a major leap for establishing a virtual landscape. Without any new revisions, it has continued to worked.


type: message
date: 2023-01-09 21:29:15
edit_date: 2023-01-10 02:28:05
content:
  What I also admire is the continued releases of Mods to provide additional functionality and fixes to Neos even though Neos has not received updates in a long time.


type: message
date: 2023-01-09 21:29:50
edit_date: 2023-01-10 02:28:13
content:
  An example was Stiefel's Animj Mod which fixes at least three bugs in the Animj importer that were needed for me to be able to import and drive the drone show for the New Year's world.


type: message
date: 2023-01-10 02:30:07
content:
  It would be nice if neos was not a physical company, but a decentralized autonomous organization, DAO.


type: message
date: 2023-01-10 02:41:06
content:
  I'd rather not. Neos isn't quite in the position to go down that route, especially with its codebase and current state. Such actions would only result in further uproar from the only people who are actually on the platform in order to pleasure those who haven't even stepped foot in it


type: message
date: 2023-01-10 03:28:17
content:
  DAO's wouldn't work, Neos needs a company to own the data, the privacy policy, the legal requirements etc, the server costs.

  I've yet to see a DAO that can handle that kind of thing(please feel free to share some). But at the end of the day its always a physical person or company running the show.


type: message
date: 2023-01-10 10:33:22
content:
  The two owner of the company developing neos are in a clinch. Both tugging on the other end of the rope, not giving an inch "working out" a solution. So we all have to wait for the solution that obviously is for the two to split up.


type: message
date: 2023-01-10 10:39:29
content:
  well, the last update was a major bugfix hotpatch... and that was really it. So the last true major was back in November


type: message
date: 2023-01-10 19:00:40
content:
  It’s said in the discord that neos community is a loving one. Why with such great love, the tech team not inclusive of cryptocurrency community members?


type: message
date: 2023-01-10 19:02:13
content:
  there is more than a few who are part of cryptocurrency but however, do not attempt to share their ideals with literally everyone
  maybe that also makes them more difficult to find
  but they exist :)


type: message
date: 2023-01-10 19:12:09
content:
  It's complicated, so much so I don't think that can be actively discussed here due to the established rules here. One need only to look at where the larger majority of users are and how they view crypto to get a glimpse on one aspect, with the other being that of the people who came from the crypto community having done nothing on the platform itself, where user numbers didn't change at all. Had the actual user count gone up, the tune would different


type: message
date: 2023-01-10 19:13:51
content:
  That is why you will actively hear Neos is fine, but the other aspect isn't. Additionally, when the platform had it's possible moment to shine at its brightest (aka VRCpocalyspe), the platform and its users were the ones to step in... not NCR and crypto.


type: message
date: 2023-01-10 19:52:26
content:
  Do people have the negative freedom that Isaiah Berlin speaks of? A lot of people are not engineers and don't do a lot of building, but we are all promoting the neos vr platform. It takes some patience to attract enough smart people to come in and there will be Goose Goose Duck-like opportunities


type: message
date: 2023-01-10 19:58:16
content:
  I have no clue who Isaiah is, but claiming that the platform only has "builders and engineers" somewhat defeats the entire point. The thing is that say that is true: then why are there no visitors? At that statement, Neos is just a visitorless museum of creations with people who proclaim support by promoting it.


type: message
date: 2023-01-10 20:01:11
content:
  If that's indeed the case, the number of promotors far surpasses the number of visitors and 'engineers' combined. That, to many extents, only highlights the point further. Neos isn't just for builders and creators; it's supposed to be for everyone. If people actually signed in, gave critique and concepts of solutions, instead of uttering lunar phrases like a endless chant and speculating on value, the tune many people would be singing wouldn't be as it is now


type: message
date: 2023-01-10 23:50:34
content:
  There are so many creations in Neos VR, it takes a really long time to see them all. This also comes due to contests and fairs having been done. MMC is this contest, CJ is something called creator jam where people meet regularly just to create for a single topic, everyone can join and optionally take part in the creation. Those worlds are still up for visits later then. Also there is Neos Festa, a kind of fair with a subset of what content creators made so far in Neos VR. There is a lot to discover in Neos VR. Maybe find a guide by hanging out in the MTC tutorial world and asking whoever joins, what kind of interesting worlds there are in Neos.


type: message
date: 2023-01-11 04:12:03
content:
  Oh, huh. I have no idea Froox was doing their own workshop stuff. Would have saved me the headache with their websockets and HTTP one.


type: message
date: 2023-01-11 06:46:14
content:
  its kind of hard to optimise for user generated content and due to how the world model currently works, but there's always going to be the users that refuse to optimise such as too many blend shapes or polygons or heavy processing logix


type: message
date: 2023-01-11 06:47:15
content:
  integrated with UE ? unreal engine there is no plan to move Neos to unreal engine due to licensing issues of the engine plus that wouldn't solve the issues with optimisation


type: message
date: 2023-01-11 06:51:46
content:
  also comparing linear to gamma is not much of a difference what is a difference is switching from frustrum culling to occlusion culling would be nice


type: message
date: 2023-01-11 14:18:16
content:
  anyone can become familiar with the ui/ux
  it is better than most, just it is unique
  unity is the bigger issue
  as for what neos can run on
  an average gaming pc can run it
  my laptop can :P
  the idea that so many vr titles should exist on a mobile platform is degrading, since you compromise the focus of the app just to run it on the absolute lowest denominator
  it is an interesting and challenging limitation to have but it also isnt necessarily a good one


type: message
date: 2023-01-11 14:41:34
content:
  Mobile platforms will catch up to the point that neos can run on it. In fact i am pretty sure that platforms like this will reach the same performance OR integrate wireless completly in the next years. We already have that to some degree, because a cable is obviously downgrading vr experiences.


type: message
date: 2023-01-11 14:43:11
content:
  I mean seriously, neos has a android client and it runs great. Seriously. The only problem is that the machines running it have 4 or 6 gb of ram. Start any world, except an empty one, and it crashes. Its not the fault of neos, its the hardware limitation as such.


type: message
date: 2023-01-11 15:05:45
edit_date: 2023-01-11 15:06:04
content:
  Neos is not meant for mobile, even though there is an official android version. Let alone because 99% is community created content. Everybody has other standards of optimizing their stuff or not at all.


type: message
date: 2023-01-11 15:24:18
edit_date: 2023-01-11 15:24:34
content:
  What i mean is: "Mobile" VR headsets will fast enough close the gap to not require user-optimization. You would also be surprised how well it actually works. Just a question of time.


type: message
date: 2023-01-11 16:38:44
content:
  thinking about that one user i met with over 20000 slots on their avatar.. backpack system ugh
  it wasn't even a rex


type: message
date: 2023-01-11 17:04:28
content:
  I'll also confirm the android version runs fine. Oddly, the requirements for mobile processing isn't as steep. Additionally, Neos has the ability to rebake textures at different resolutions, so it's possible to just request the system to rebake at a reduced resolution to reduce memory requirements on mobile.


type: message
date: 2023-01-11 17:06:03
content:
  Additionally, with the Steam Deck being a thing, that can act as a litmus test for portable operations, since standalone systems are improving in capabilities.


type: message
date: 2023-01-11 17:07:10
content:
  i don't fully understand neos asset system, but i assume all asset variants are separate of the original image file, the user downloads the original i believe
  for mobile that might mean extra data use?


type: message
date: 2023-01-11 17:09:34
content:
  possibly
  there is the option to set a max resolution on a texture, i guess that is the maximum size of the generated variant
  but i mean the original image file is still downloaded always


type: message
date: 2023-01-11 17:11:37
content:
  Well... depends on the texture format. With KTX, it stores things as progressive mipmap, so the filestream doesn't even need to complete to have at least something loaded in. I'm guessing to save bandwidth, a clientside 'max resolution' setting could be used and if the textures do allow streaming (it is an option to disable this on the texture settings, including mipmapping), only download enough until satisfied.


type: message
date: 2023-01-11 17:12:41
content:
  would be nice for neos to download initially small texture sizes just to show something instead of the many fully unloaded textures


type: message
date: 2023-01-11 17:17:10
content:
  I thought that was already a thing... hmm... I wonder what would happen if I did supply a KTX texture into Neos: would it work and would it actually gain the benefits?


type: message
date: 2023-01-11 17:17:40
content:
  (I mean, seriously, it understands Milkshape3D as a 3D format; asking for another odd file type isn't exactly too odd of a question for the platform)


type: message
date: 2023-01-11 17:19:13
edit_date: 2023-01-11 18:14:50
content:
  Well, that's one disadvantage. They have to sacrifice something. Either just use the original image and have more space on cloud or generate mipmaps beforehand. Imo they should do both, by generating mipmaps when the textures get loaded. That would be a temporary lag spike, but should pay out at the end.


type: message
date: 2023-01-11 17:47:21
content:
  and a recent tweet from me just so i could add onto this https://fxtwitter.com/xLinkaVR/status/1613230301764882432


type: message
date: 2023-01-11 17:53:48
content:
  When I try to share, I get loads of hate and rejection. I'm called a Crypto Bro, and kicked from worlds.


type: message
date: 2023-01-11 18:08:01
content:
  I disagree, these people literally want nothing to do with cryptocurrency, and reject the very notion in conversation.


type: message
date: 2023-01-11 18:16:40
content:
  once again: we gave you the reasons why it is heavily frowned upon with quite a few users. However, not all users have immediate issues, so this doesn't apply to everyone.


type: message
date: 2023-01-11 18:23:35
content:
  hmm... I can concur a bit with that. The current tutorial is more of a presentation, rather than an exercise. Just me, but I prefer conditional training, where there's a task and goal, which helps demonstrate the user knows the foundations before moving forward.
  Oh, and having the tutorial's world size reduced would also be nice. It's a pretty chunky boi


type: message
date: 2023-01-11 18:23:36
edit_date: 2023-01-11 18:23:56
content:
  You can tell people where things are in the UI and help them along sure, but on it's own it isn't entirely intuitive. Even the settings itself it just a long list of items. And you can't even edit your dashboard without the secret button combo.

  I'm not gonna say it's bad, it's just not intuitive, yet.


type: message
date: 2023-01-11 18:24:15
content:
  BUT... yeah, I'll admit that I was able to teach users who had NO experience with VR how to use Neos in less than a half hour. Mind you, I was also having to teach them the basics of VR as well.


type: message
date: 2023-01-11 18:28:03
content:
  as for the crypto thing, that was a product of its time. During that era, the attitude with such wasn't like it is now. Back then, it was viewed more as an alternative to PayPal and similar services, during a time when trust with banks were pretty low.
  However, at this time, Neos doesn't have any direct cryptographic functions within itself, and the irony of the gridlock is that the situation also proves how much it didn't need it, since a year of no updates later, and it's lack of inclusion hasn't hindered it at all.


type: message
date: 2023-01-11 18:30:59
content:
  The irony being that VRC is constantly advertised as "a place where you can build or be anything"...


type: message
date: 2023-01-11 18:32:36
content:
  I'm aware of the legal situation, however it is operating. For me, I have no intentions of returning to VRC, given I still am not in favor of their business practices and their community can <redacted for moderation reasons>


type: message
date: 2023-01-11 18:35:32
content:
  that is very subjective. You don't hear about users complaining the same with Chillout, which I'm positive has more tools to convert VRC components to COVR, but that doesn't dismiss the fact the systems are different.
  However, that does highlight a point that I've made a few times, namely that not everyone does import custom avatars, let alone the entire process. In most VRC cases, avatars are set up by creators, and that process, by comparison, is a nightmare. I'll openly admit that VRChat's avatar creation tools are by far the worst I've ever dealt with, even with the backing of Unity helping it.


type: message
date: 2023-01-11 18:37:18
content:
  The problem is the ownership of the code. You can't just copy and do whatever you want. Github, while commonly a place for open source projects, is also a tool for closed source projects, which Neos currently is. Change the system, and the situation doesn't really change. This is why forking the code isn't an option.


type: message
date: 2023-01-11 18:40:27
content:
  another legal battle, same end point should one result in a shutdown. Just the latter one would then include additional issues such as code theft and possible anti-competition clauses. I'm not a lawyer, but those two I can place wagers on with some reliance.


type: message
date: 2023-01-11 18:42:30
content:
  those two points do not have a relation. It doesn't matter if VRC has the most or the least: it has nothing to do with anticompetition clauses if you want to just copy the code or form a mirrored service.


type: message
date: 2023-01-11 18:44:57
content:
  that wasn't the point. If either founder right now took the code and mirrored it, they could be in competition with themselves with said fork, unless the legal situation has been dismissed and, should any clauses exist, that any handling of ownership is managed and/or additional conditions


type: message
date: 2023-01-11 18:45:21
content:
  I am positive you mean well, but you really don't understand the situation and just want a solution, the penalties be darned. That's just not how it works in the real world, at least without ramifications.


type: message
date: 2023-01-11 18:48:19
content:
  the problem is there is nothing that can really be done except to try and form services that replace the required ones. If people want to create their own cloud services with plug-ins as an alternative to Neos's provided services, that is doable and could be done without causing issues with the situation.


type: message
date: 2023-01-11 18:49:08
content:
  otherwise, there isn't a solution that the community can really do, and both parties involved can't do anything until something is resolved between themselves


type: message
date: 2023-01-11 18:51:08
content:
  I dunno. I can't beleive I'm even humoring this idea but... is Karel good at Quake 3? Just have him and Froox deathmatch it out like when Bethesda had their lawsuit over Mojang over the name 'Scrolls'


type: message
date: 2023-01-11 18:51:49
content:
  most of the contributions outside of froox are not under disputed ownership so maybe that is actually feasible


type: message
date: 2023-01-11 18:56:02
content:
  if i had a dollar for every time i found a better way to do something (component replacing logix or just more efficient logix) id be rich


type: message
date: 2023-01-11 19:00:03
content:
  speaking of which i think your api duplicates some entries
  i was able to use the list you gave me so it is offline


type: message
date: 2023-01-11 19:01:13
edit_date: 2023-01-11 19:01:22
content:
  hm what do you mean..?
  you can try using shortcuts instead, makes it easier to add launch arguments like for neos mods


type: message
date: 2023-01-12 05:58:27
content:
  The risks of Metavers 👇

  https://twitter.com/gamertagvr/status/1613164457227685888?s=46&t=npwGg2cQvb_w4cFm9itmLg


type: message
date: 2023-01-12 10:56:32
content:
  eh... while VR is a factor for a metaverse, it isn't a requirement. It's immersive, but if someone goes in with a phone or laptop, they won't have body tracking persay


type: message
date: 2023-01-12 10:58:18
content:
  however, that would be why LL is (finally) adding things like webcam tracking. Such things that allow better embodiment will be an interesting key in how socializing occurs on platforms


type: message
date: 2023-01-12 11:17:38
content:
  Stop trying to make this community platform tailor itself to the mainstream low poly Quest/PICO Standalone crowd.


type: message
date: 2023-01-12 11:24:39
content:
  Also My clients have synced their Oculus to a cloud computer through their Iphone to access NEOS without a local laptop device. It's possible to run NEOS through distributed cloud compute rather than a local laptop.


type: message
date: 2023-01-12 11:36:53
content:
  also, the lighting system is linear; Geenz mentioned that was to be addressed, but is now held back for obvious reasons...


type: message
date: 2023-01-12 13:35:00
content:
  something for professional applications, it existed but was ran really poorly for a while
  now it is even no longer advertised


type: message
date: 2023-01-12 13:37:47
content:
  what no
  basically aka terrible simplification, neos pro is (supposed to be) for cases where you need professional support with neos or integration with your own services


type: message
date: 2023-01-12 13:42:28
content:
  not to say that the workshops and other events aren't "professional" but those are all focused within neos


type: message
date: 2023-01-12 13:54:12
content:
  coming back to this, of course it is not
  what did happen though is neos cultivated an inviting community
  . and also one where various things are more possible


type: message
date: 2023-01-12 13:58:11
content:
  It was always the case. VLC is a mirror simulator. Pretty much the content of it is to look in a mirror, seeing yourself. But Neos is far to complicated for the average stupid user. I mean its no mystery why apple is so successful. They never really invented, they made accessable. Thats basicly it. And it is a missing ingredient for neos still.


type: message
date: 2023-01-12 14:01:03
content:
  I kind of prefer neos for the very reason of what it is. This system might be only accessable to slightly over average... technically inclined. But as such also a space where you actually find such people


type: message
date: 2023-01-12 14:01:24
content:
  ie actually usable mute helper
  a keyboard that doesn't suck
  translators
  locomotion modes without needing external software


type: message
date: 2023-01-12 14:02:24
content:
  god when vrc added their own mute helper i had trouble telling if it was actually working let alone if anyone could read my messages


type: message
date: 2023-01-12 14:02:27
content:
  Its a space where you "just go and create" and as such it is nice. But beside the obvious, there is also the clinch between the 2 owners we can't forget here. Before that is not solved, talking about accessability and more people is not really reasonable


type: message
date: 2023-01-12 14:03:53
content:
  well obviously not. There is a critical mass. If neos would be as successful, player base wise, it would be


type: message
date: 2023-01-12 14:04:56
content:
  Doesn't mather. If it would be, neos would be really dead by now. Because while in this deep freeze state, it could never grow over a certain point


type: message
date: 2023-01-12 14:05:45
content:
  It is actually good that neos is overlooked until everything is solved with the owners, because there is only one thing more dangerous then stopped deveopment. Its stopped development while in player growth


type: message
date: 2023-01-12 14:06:39
content:
  i had my tutorial session set to public
  you really need an open mind or everything seems impossible..
  i wonder how simplified neos can get before it becomes an insult to existing users
  or theyll just be happy things are easier
  i would be


type: message
date: 2023-01-12 14:06:54
content:
  You can't have a growing player base, creating new problems, creating new load, creating more reason for nefarious people to find cracks


type: message
date: 2023-01-12 14:08:37
content:
  But the owner have to really get their shit togehter. This will not happen again most likely. If anything major happens and neos gets in the focus...


type: message
date: 2023-01-12 14:11:06
content:
  Well, its not dead yet, but i often feel like the owners of neos are not aware how much luck they have every day if its not the last of neos


type: message
date: 2023-01-12 14:14:15
content:
  It doesn't even mather who prevails, its just a question to finally end it. If froox gets full control, it will still be called neos and there will be a big patch and after that... everything stays mostly normal.
  If froox doesn't, well there will be most likely 2 versions. One called neos, one neox (i am joking) and the two owners have 2 different things that result out of this project. One will probably prevail


type: message
date: 2023-01-12 14:15:07
content:
  It doesn't really mather that much. Worst case the name changes. Its just a question of... finally getting to a resolution


type: message
date: 2023-01-12 14:16:47
content:
  To be fair, crypto didn't ruined the platform really. It was the massiv amount of money suddenly involved that changed what neos is/was. The virtual currency was suddenly worth more then the code (for a short time)


type: message
date: 2023-01-12 14:17:22
content:
  And that triggert the break, as both sides had vastly different idea how to go forward with neos (and the software license)


type: message
date: 2023-01-12 14:18:38
content:
  Its easy to assign blame. I just want the two to finally come to a solution. If they would understand how little actually depends on who gets the name "neos" this might have been over for years


type: message
date: 2023-01-12 14:19:44
content:
  And to be entirely truthful, while i think there could be an interesting open source project without froox, we still want to see his creation of what he thinks neos is


type: message
date: 2023-01-12 14:19:46
content:
  well you already are up to speed
  theres not a lot we really really need to know and there is nothing else to disclose about it


type: message
date: 2023-01-12 14:20:40
content:
  The name doesn't mather really, thats what the two should have figured out by now. Its a miracle this stand still is in the interest of them both in any way


type: message
date: 2023-01-12 15:30:47
content:
  I promoted neos vr at a vr entertainment store in Bangkok today, the manager thanked me and said he would install neos vr on every computer


type: message
date: 2023-01-12 19:37:39
content:
  Sansar is... complicated. It was sold off, then it was silently shutdown... but then it wasn't because someone was asleep at the wheel... it's in a weird place.


type: message
date: 2023-01-12 19:43:06
content:
  overall, it was an okay place. I avoided it because I was informed it ran like early XP machines playing Crysis. It wasn't quite that bad, but most of its bad press was also from Second Life users who are old and hate change just didn't like the idea of there being another system by the Lab.


type: message
date: 2023-01-12 22:36:37
content:
  there is no UI on the neos website for changing my password. and i tried mail recovery but never received an email


type: message
date: 2023-01-12 22:41:41
content:
  yeah... especially since the site has been acting weird as of late... at least with its redirecting handling


type: message
date: 2023-01-12 23:15:14
content:
  Any chance we could stop talking about the 404 verification bs which i repeatedly explain is not an issue of incompetence or inability but is actually one of communication.

  Thanks!


type: message
date: 2023-01-13 16:37:10
content:
  Was about to say. At this point, NCR is just an apology to its users by giving them free storage space.


type: message
date: 2023-01-13 19:16:17
content:
  NCR was founded by karel as a means for ingame economy and funding and as a reward to users, original intent was not for exchange listings but if thats your opinion sure XD


type: message
date: 2023-01-13 19:24:47
content:
  yeah... thinking back, wasn't it just supposed to be getting initial funding for the internal markets? The reward more or less being once everything was running, having the NCR meant you could supply creators and the like for their goods via internal exchange, with external being a cashout for those who need it?


type: message
date: 2023-01-13 19:33:14
content:
  Nft's are here to stay, same as baseball card collectors. We can discuss if Charichard card is valued reasonably at 300k but it would be pointless. So just stop fighting windmills, my furry friend


type: message
date: 2023-01-13 19:40:27
content:
  Zero is an absolute statement, it's not true. You can read at least 2-3 updates. Remember to use precision of language in such things. If you said "there hasn't been a recent update" then sure. But saying there has been zero is disingenuous.


type: message
date: 2023-01-13 19:44:18
content:
  Well not so sure about that, the last "update" from Frooxius if I remember right, was actually letting community know what has happened and what he wants with his devs (Karel out). After that there has been radio silence so zero updates might just be right. Unless something has happened in these last months


type: message
date: 2023-01-13 19:48:38
content:
  Cool thanks for adjusting your language remember that any update is an update. Even if you don't like it. There have been other updates. Including in here.


type: message
date: 2023-01-13 20:09:11
edit_date: 2023-01-13 20:29:04
content:
  the last "update" if you will call it that is some form of discussion is still happening-karel mentions in this channel
  not really an update if it brings nothing new


type: message
date: 2023-01-13 21:08:44
edit_date: 2023-01-13 21:13:37
content:
  I prefer to actually have the collector's card instead of just a receipt of ownership of something hosted on opensea for everyone to download and copy


type: message
date: 2023-01-13 21:13:56
content:
  While many may not like NCR, it did help with some initial funding for neos. I can't agree that it should have *never* existed


type: message
date: 2023-01-13 21:14:25
content:
  Well, one way you could use them in Neos, the other way, it's a moderation issue that might get you banned


type: message
date: 2023-01-13 21:16:29
content:
  Patreon certainly helped to keep it running, I also see other funding, that I believe happened through education


type: message
date: 2023-01-13 21:26:38
content:
  Visionaries see the future, not the present.
  The founders are incredible visionaries.

  NRC has future potential


type: message
date: 2023-01-13 21:31:34
content:
  Neos is not a competitor to VRChat and also not the other way round. They are distinct enough to be each their own


type: message
date: 2023-01-13 21:32:44
content:
  No
  But when I see what was created I hope that something good comes. 
  Sometimes good things need their time.


type: message
date: 2023-01-13 21:35:31
content:
  VRC is not a competitor of Neos, Neos does not maintain a fully functional social platform. You can socialize but there are limitations in comparison to VRC


type: message
date: 2023-01-13 21:37:29
content:
  Neos isn't a finished platform, maybe I should put it that way. It can be a lot more than it is now, but its not there yet


type: message
date: 2023-01-13 21:41:33
edit_date: 2023-01-14 04:24:42
content:
  I think Neos broke in November 2021. And it doesn't look like anyone is visibly trying to fix it. I cannot say anything about things happening away from the public, as I don't know for sure


type: message
date: 2023-01-13 21:42:49
content:
  Neos is currently in a weird spot. It can decide now to be a service or a system.

  A service would be like how VRC and COVR operate, with the client talking to the central systems for login, cloud storage, and the like.

  A system would be... like Neos, where it can run independently on its own (see LAN mode and Headless-Clients).


type: message
date: 2023-01-13 21:43:03
content:
  The steam version is cut anyway. I mean yes, its only the ncr but considering that steam just happend to forbid a featur of the game, i usually run the full version anyway


type: message
date: 2023-01-13 21:43:26
content:
  Weird, as they are identical, except for the missing token part, that has been conditionally excluded from compiling on the steam version


type: message
date: 2023-01-13 21:45:31
content:
  that also wouldn't do anything with the Steam build.... because at that point, the web build still talks to SteamVR just the same as the other build.


type: message
date: 2023-01-13 21:47:34
edit_date: 2023-01-13 21:48:16
content:
  It doesn't matter if standalone (web download) or steam version, they both use the same directories for database and cache. The standalone even calls into steam and registers play time and uses steam sockets, when steam is running


type: message
date: 2023-01-13 21:49:21
content:
  my guess is that when launching the Steam version, Steam tries to launch SteamVR. With the web build, I'm guessing it checks which runtime is actually active (OpenXR or Oculus). In theory, the Steam build CAN be made to use the Oculus build via a parameter or using the launcher


type: message
date: 2023-01-13 21:50:18
content:
  additionally, that's a different objective point: SteamVR is a system for hardware handling. Neos is an application


type: message
date: 2023-01-13 22:01:19
content:
  also using a separate server for assets / local storage mod is just hell and strain for other users in session making it more miserable since your loading a local:// asset meaning it uploads to the host and then back to every user putting strain on network even causing desync and the textures wont be optimised by the asset variant server so thats even worse


type: message
date: 2023-01-13 22:02:23
edit_date: 2023-01-13 22:06:46
content:
  Neos doesnt not use openxr it uses oculus openvr or steam which is just openvr but on the other hand, -RiftTouch as a launch argument will force neos to use oculus runtime


type: message
date: 2023-01-13 22:09:03
content:
  that's something I've been meaning to look into is if there is a way to host self optimized assets. For example, is there a way to upload a texture to a web server that has the optimizations presented in Neos? Would be interesting for some headless systems, if the strain of syncing could be offloaded with a setup like that. Plus, it could introduce some better security concepts


type: message
date: 2023-01-13 22:23:17
content:
  the solution is saving the item in inventory and keeping it there but also exporting its 7zbson then using that 7zbson to cloudspawn as it assets will be optimised by the asset variation server


type: message
date: 2023-01-14 03:39:00
content:
  We don't need to convince everyone to like cryptocurrencies, and nft does need geniuses to explore right now. Many cryptocurrency-hating artists are now exploring nft too


type: message
date: 2023-01-14 04:50:03
content:
  the irony of that statement being what Neos, this channel's representation, being mostly, even if it has a desktop mode...


type: message
date: 2023-01-14 07:45:02
content:
  I'll embrace what works, and clearly one still let's me do things like play games, hang out, and respond to these messages, and the other is monopoly money that doubles as a storage coupon


type: message
date: 2023-01-14 14:23:42
content:
  The android build works pretty well, even if not officially supported "to play". Its main limitation is that it "just crashes" the moment the ram fills up


type: message
date: 2023-01-14 16:56:42
content:
  so its not that kind of surprising that neos has difficulties. It also probably was never intended to run on a pc with 2 gb usable ram


type: message
date: 2023-01-14 17:36:27
content:
  To be fair, I did test it on a 4GB junker laptop to help test a few things (namely, which platforms could run in the worst of conditions) and Neos DID work fine


type: message
date: 2023-01-14 19:28:10
content:
  pcs have the luxury of fast ssd swap (usually) while mobile devices generally don't tend to use storage as "extra ram"


type: message
date: 2023-01-14 19:29:34
content:
  if memory serves me well, mobile devices also don't really have dedicated video memory: they just have a chunk of memory that is used for both data and graphical information.


type: message
date: 2023-01-14 19:30:22
content:
  The laptop was a Dell junker so... I only dedicated 1GB to it. It ran 'okay' but obviously not the best. Difference between Running and Running Well, if you will


type: message
date: 2023-01-14 19:41:29
content:
  I mean, even the 3200mb/s ram cant compete with actual ram, and most "fast" ssd's don't reach that, even the M.2 ones


type: message
date: 2023-01-15 13:58:06
content:
  Generic as in, you could say that to nearly anything anyone here said. Sergej also has a full name (happens but unusual here) and has only written that single sentence, not any other input before. Thats all indications of a bot, but doesn't nessesarily mean that it is.


type: message
date: 2023-01-15 14:00:15
content:
  I didn't write that^^ but the expection is that an automatic answer will come that obviously will not match with what was said


type: message
date: 2023-01-15 18:33:50
content:
  Only issue is the weird rendering difference in mirrors, which enable some things I wish were on by default


type: message
date: 2023-01-15 18:50:28
content:
  i have a pretty old headset (by now), the steam valve index. Before i had the first oculus that really had a bad resolution. But since the valve index and a pc upgrade it does look pretty crisp


type: message
date: 2023-01-15 18:55:44
content:
  yeah. The visual differences when you upgrade the headset's resolution is immense. I say this as someone who had a DK2.


type: message
date: 2023-01-15 19:06:34
content:
  well... yes and no. A better computer means better performance, but visual fidelity will always be held back by the outputs... namely the HMDs


type: message
date: 2023-01-15 19:07:39
content:
  yeah. That's the bare minimum for VR back even when the CV1 was new... and that was before the whole 'Ti' business


type: message
date: 2023-01-15 19:10:57
content:
  yeah. in VR, I can get about 120 FPS on average in rooms with at least one or two other people, but about 60-70 when in areas with 15+


type: message
date: 2023-01-15 19:12:47
content:
  mind you, the 120-144 is also when I am streaming my deck, have chrome open, and with face tracking (which burdens the system further due to no onboard processing)


type: message
date: 2023-01-17 14:02:59
content:
  you can find the latest updates pinned here, pinned in the discord or in the discord announcements section.

  Now before you say "but there is no updates" I want you to re-read the message I Just sent.


type: message
date: 2023-01-17 14:19:26
content:
  Hey we don't have an "Admin' we have a team. 

  I am a member of said team and regardless of my opinions on the matter my message is accurate. Your holder update is above and applies regardless of your opinion.


type: message
date: 2023-01-17 14:23:27
content:
  Ok well next time perhaps state that in your original message. This isn't a command line program or chat bot this is a community. Explain your question in more detail and you'll get a better answer through being nice and clear.


type: message
date: 2023-01-17 14:27:27
content:
  Hey we don't have an "Admin' we have a team, you've been told this before, and you've been given an update periodically. You can find it in the pinned messages.

  Making demands is never ok. Asking politely is.


type: message
date: 2023-01-17 14:30:01
content:
  Nft world is sued with Minecraft and there is twitter space every week for update. I ask for update nicely in telegram and discord FUD always answer...


type: message
date: 2023-01-17 14:30:37
content:
  I haven't provided FUD at all, I've just provided Facts.

  You didn't ask nicely you just said "Update?"


type: message
date: 2023-01-17 14:37:42
content:
  Now that's just rude, can I remind you we have rules here in this telegram and that not following them will result in moderation action.


type: message
date: 2023-01-17 14:46:09
content:
  the ceo didn't give any more information since the pin. The admin of this telegram group has no connection to ncr


type: message
date: 2023-01-17 14:46:38
content:
  Ok, then ask that nicely :) Use words, sentences etc.

  I hope you have a great day. I'm going to go think about cheese


type: message
date: 2023-01-17 14:48:33
edit_date: 2023-01-17 17:54:55
content:
  FUD is thrown around too much. 

  Every project needs people who criticise or provide feedback that can be viewed as negative, its how they grow. Every major company deals with it and its fine. 

  Screaming "FUD" is like walking into a restaurant and asking anyone that didn't enjoy their food to piss off because their opinion is invalid. 

  So in summary, its like a kitchen nightmares episode.


type: message
date: 2023-01-17 15:21:17
content:
  Because neos is currently stuck between the two owners that don't find a common way out. Also the bubble burst, it was overvalued. Neos is still in development and has only a small amount of players. Noone knows what happens if neos gets actually released/continued to develop. But at the moment, its stuck.


type: message
date: 2023-01-17 15:25:44
content:
  i think it is an otherwise fun idea
  you pay for tokens that get used over time depending on your actual storage use


type: message
date: 2023-01-17 15:28:21
content:
  i think the idea that it needs to be specifically crypto is limited, if it will only be within the platform
  if there were more cross-platform opportunities then it might make more sense


type: message
date: 2023-01-17 15:37:19
content:
  Next years will see so many changes in computer games in general. We now have games where we actually tell npc what to say, often only a single sentence. Lifeless, very limited content and unique characters, small amount of interactibles and near no reaction to interactions in the world. Now we see what ChatGPT can do and how you can create believable characters by pure description of their character and abilities. The things that will change in the next 2-3 years will totally catch the whole industry by surprise. It would be a shame neos is stuck for all that time in a limbo^^


type: message
date: 2023-01-17 16:25:36
content:
  I wonder what integration will be possible by then.. and if you would really want it
  ai simulating a realistic person would be very scary


type: message
date: 2023-01-17 16:38:34
content:
  yes, well, realistic person is already close to reality (as one of the developers of the google ai got known by saying that he believes that this AI is alive) but in general... it doesn't even need to be 100% believable. I mean we are having computer games with npc's that know 1-3 lines, thousands of them in the same game for some rpg and we just accept that as "yea thats how games are". If they would actually react to what you do, talk, interact with each other. Would change everything.


type: message
date: 2023-01-17 17:55:52
content:
  If you want to write NPCs for Neos, you probably can hook chatgpt via a websocket in for threir text.

  But holy hell that will be a lot of work.


type: message
date: 2023-01-17 17:58:42
content:
  I mean... that's a bit of what happened with a certain other platform, though in that one's case, it was an even more extreme by streaming user audio channels to a cloud based caption system to translate voice to text for scriptable processing. Such event handling would be neat in Neos, but making the module would be an absolute test of patience


type: message
date: 2023-01-17 18:28:12
content:
  There's a few mute helpers that do this live, but afaik they all use a web browser with webrtc to perform the transcription and then relay that back into Neos via a websocket


type: message
date: 2023-01-17 18:29:57
content:
  ah hmm... I'm guessing a plugin service could be used to simplify it a tiny bit, but at that point, it'd still be the same thing so... hmm...


type: message
date: 2023-01-17 18:32:12
content:
  A plugin that independently acquires the audio stream locally, or were you thinking of something that utilizes the Neos audio stream directly?


type: message
date: 2023-01-17 18:33:38
edit_date: 2023-01-17 18:37:50
content:
  For NARA, I utilized WebRTC and Mediasoup to handle the mic and audio to and from the radio, and then using user positions in Neos I was able to use the WebRTC spatialized audio feature to mimic the spatialization in Neos so the user always hears the audio coming from the radio with near real-time updates


type: message
date: 2023-01-17 18:34:20
content:
  I decided to go this way as it only required a web browser - which everyone has - and didn't need to act as another user in the world or required tapping into the Neos audio stream or a plugin


type: message
date: 2023-01-17 18:36:01
content:
  NARA is the Neos Amateur Radio Association, we operate amateur radio directly from Neos just like we are operating radios IRL


type: message
date: 2023-01-17 19:03:59
content:
  its not that difficult, but no, i would not use the existing test-ai for that. But with the release of the 4.0 in 2 month and hopefully some new models you can download (there are already two nice ones that get close) this will soon just be easy and convenient


type: message
date: 2023-01-17 20:26:03
content:
  Yeah, I wish I could avoid the chunkiness - but I can't grant WebRTC perms in their browser automatically XD


type: message
date: 2023-01-17 20:59:56
content:
  with chrome, you can assign a webpage as 'an app' with the following:

  "C:\Program Files\Google\Chrome\Application\chrome.exe" --app=URLHERE


type: message
date: 2023-01-18 07:45:02
content:
  not sure how people get frame drops for worlds like that. I had to stress my world with intensive stuff


type: message
date: 2023-01-18 08:21:33
edit_date: 2023-01-18 08:24:15
content:
  Hi everyone☺️, I hope you are having a fantastic start of the year so far and continue to enjoy Neos regardless of the ongoing situation. We understand that the silence continues to be very frustrating, but we want to assure you that we are working hard behind the scenes and have some exciting updates in the works. Rest assured, the wait will be worth it.☺️

  So in the meantime, we would still like to ask for your patience and understanding and especially not harbouring negativity against the current team or any of the admins of this channel - which for the record to make it clear, the only official admins/moderators of this channel are myself, @NonnyFreedom and Karel. But thank you @ProbablePrime for your prompt and valuable responses as always. There is no doubt that you have the best interests of the Neos community at heart. And of course thanks to all of you, active members of the group - for being here, being patient and keeping the channel alive (and on occasions full of amusement😁)

  Really, thanks guys for all your support and stay tuned for updates...it's coming!☺️🚀


type: message
date: 2023-01-18 08:42:20
content:
  Hi @OwOSlushee2 , my message really was not intended as a direct response to your message, apologies if that seemed this way. And I am sorry you have some issues with your world. I hope you manage to find a solution going forward. I understand that building something for 80+ hours and hitting a dead end is more than frustrating.


type: message
date: 2023-01-18 08:44:09
content:
  I am sure a lot of people here or on Discord will be happy to help if you explain in more detail. Neos community is absolutelly fantastic this way.


type: message
date: 2023-01-18 12:25:58
edit_date: 2023-01-19 03:40:33
content:
  I don't want to sound rude. But I don't like this message. At this time it's been over a year without any valuable information, that is publicly available to anyone. I would never assume, that you would spread wrong information in any means, but by just saying "hard working" which was already stated multiple times, without us knowing if there is even progress at all. You could say anything regardless of if it's true or not. But I do appreciate your message and statement. I hope there is some progress, to round of this message positively.


type: message
date: 2023-01-18 17:39:41
content:
  I think that most people who actually use Neos would be in the same position... except that NCR is love storage, NCR is life extra space.


type: message
date: 2023-01-18 17:53:31
content:
  Hard working for over a year with no details... maybe cooperating with Valve to make Half Life 3 inside Neos? Or did I put the bar too low?


type: message
date: 2023-01-18 18:08:32
content:
  uh... no? Last update was back around November of 2021, with the last minor update to the software in January of 2022 for a security hotfix.


type: message
date: 2023-01-18 18:11:06
content:
  hmm... was the Discord poll thing really that long ago? I thought it was closer to the last major platform update.


type: message
date: 2023-01-18 18:12:14
content:
  I have to lose too much to sell. If to stake to give 20 to 60 percent to me over this year. I to not lose more


type: message
date: 2023-01-18 18:12:28
content:
  Wow... huh.... the polls were actually in December. Color me surprised. So they are only just over a year old now.


type: message
date: 2023-01-18 18:15:35
content:
  Not sure or aware of any relations with another coin. This channel only really is in direct discussion of NCR's token and Neos the platform, so not sure what Kucion has to do with NCR or Neos's current condition. Of course, if you want something that works right now, then there is the Neos platform itself.


type: message
date: 2023-01-18 18:17:45
content:
  ...I just had my patreon running for headless support, even during my hiatus when the menu system brought out the devil in me I wasn't quite ready to figure everything out.


type: message
date: 2023-01-18 18:19:41
content:
  Hmm... I should have sold, but I am fine either way. I didn't sell the lion's share of doge that I recovered from a 2016 wallet, and I'm still okay.


type: message
date: 2023-01-18 18:21:52
content:
  In either case, I still hoard my NCR, because having storage space until the heat death of the universe is just amusing to me


type: message
date: 2023-01-19 04:04:39
edit_date: 2023-01-19 04:19:36
content:
  I totally get where you're coming from. It's been long. Too long. Crazy long. I am cringing myself every time I write a generic message like this, trust me on that, but it is just the way it has to be for now. 

  We cannot give any information that would be against company’s interest, I am sure that you can understand that. 

  I also understand that my words may have very little meaning and credibility at the moment. I feel like some new-agey wannabe motivational speaker at a funeral, trying to pump up the crowd with some positive b**t and getting nothing but blank stares. 

  However, I still want to assure you that we are doing everything we can, given the ongoing gridlock, to provide updates soon as we can, while also protecting the company's interests and respecting all parties involved. We do care about Neos, its community, players and all of you.


type: message
date: 2023-01-19 11:12:42
edit_date: 2023-01-19 11:24:13
content:
  i still accept it for 3d printing but that's a niche thing, but most don't want to use NCR for physical goods 🤷‍♀️


type: message
date: 2023-01-19 12:48:12
content:
  You need the client from the website, but other then that you can directly use it ingame for that purpose and 25 coins go a long way already.


type: message
date: 2023-01-19 12:49:09
content:
  well, you never know what happens that can make you unable to pay for the patreon or have other priorities ;)


type: message
date: 2023-01-19 12:55:37
content:
  I sometimes use the words "time of change" when i talk about global movements that upset the balance. Like currently based on the wars, recession and rapid AI development


type: message
date: 2023-01-19 12:56:01
content:
  The combination of factors that upsets the balance of working force and life. I like to be always prepared if such events happen ;)


type: message
date: 2023-01-19 12:57:04
content:
  Its good to adapt, but its also know that if you make a plan today, for the end of year, it will probably not happen. (Seriously, thats true currently)


type: message
date: 2023-01-19 13:25:14
content:
  Please provide staking coins while wait for update??? Holder should be given many coins to people that are the patience while there is nothing for news.


type: message
date: 2023-01-19 14:26:20
content:
  Last I checked, the only coin doing anything with the moon was doge, which was a point behind the meme. Everyone else got jelly and started using the same thing, as if it'd pass along some secret blessing.


type: message
date: 2023-01-19 16:30:15
edit_date: 2023-01-19 16:31:26
content:
  The dust on mars is mostly non toxic, but similar to earth, part of it is. But the dust of the moon has never seen erosion. Its like millions of microscopic glass splinters. If you breath in the tiniest amount, you will rip open every single blood vessle in your lungs and sufforcate in your own blood.

  The gravity on the moon is also much lower, so muscle atrophy will be much more severe. On mars that could be countered by simple activity regiment, much easier then now done on the international space station.

  Temperaturs on mars are less drastic, changes are slower and the pressure is higher (not that high, but high enough to even allow flight), so most things are simpler.


type: message
date: 2023-01-19 17:26:55
content:
  yea, well, if you remember the picture, you remember why mars isn't actually THAT bad, compared to most other places. It has air... i mean not oxygen but co2. It has a weak protection against radiation, but at least some. There are a lot of natural tunnels and sources of water and the comparativly mild temperaturs.


type: message
date: 2023-01-19 17:28:28
content:
  We just send some smokers and take away cigarrets... statisticly you would lower their risk of cancer.


type: message
date: 2023-01-19 17:30:46
content:
  and while it takes a lot of energy to take it away from the co2, the waste product is oxygen... also useful


type: message
date: 2023-01-19 17:32:08
content:
  its questionable if we could use the soil, but its not really required or that useful. We would probably extract and filter a source of nutrients directly


type: message
date: 2023-01-19 17:33:01
content:
  That's something I've been meaning to look into as a fun side project... however, I was missing a 3D printer until now, so I couldn't do much with it


type: message
date: 2023-01-19 17:33:15
content:
  To use earth is good if you have a lot of it... Like outdoors or if you have a lot of space. Hydroponics is better in a cramped space when you have enough resources to chemicly split stuff.


type: message
date: 2023-01-19 17:35:53
content:
  I mean.. if we could actually use the cavern of mars directly... you would have a lot more space. But you would needs to trust in the structure and material of that very cavern. Thats a gamble we would not take for a first mars base


type: message
date: 2023-01-19 17:37:19
content:
  So any base on mars will most likely be at a place that is partly protected from dust storms (beteween mountain/low point) on the surface. With optional use of the mars surface material to throw that on it to increase radiation protection.


type: message
date: 2023-01-19 19:02:24
content:
  Hmm... type it into the search, i am not sure. I know there are multiple worlds that have parts of mars. Like the mars rover


type: message
date: 2023-01-19 23:28:56
content:
  well, go ahead ;) i wish you a lot of luck, seriously. I have no stake in that, i just want the development to finally continue


type: message
date: 2023-01-19 23:35:45
content:
  The software itself can not be "just rewritten from ground up", its the combined work of years of labor


type: message
date: 2023-01-19 23:37:07
content:
  Well, not his, but it could be argued that the code is part of the project that is part of the company they both lead togehter


type: message
date: 2023-01-19 23:38:41
content:
  I suppose he could rewrite some of it, but the efford alone to get even close... you don't understand at all


type: message
date: 2023-01-19 23:39:13
content:
  Metal Gear Solid was done in many game engines and always just a small piece of software, every time a new episode


type: message
date: 2023-01-19 23:45:29
edit_date: 2023-01-19 23:45:38
content:
  Ok, lets end this discussion. In my opinion, you have no idea what you talking about. Crypto (well actually too much money) was the issue that triggered all this, but its not the great devil that destroyed it all. Neos just got "too big" to just being a small piece of software in development and a struggle broke out about the licencing of this software now


type: message
date: 2023-01-19 23:50:27
edit_date: 2023-01-19 23:50:42
content:
  Lets calm down... "i hacked your internet" or "i tell my dad" isn't helping anyone here. This is just something that has to be solved by the two owners. Sadly it takes exceedingly long


type: message
date: 2023-01-19 23:53:11
content:
  I am sure that he will be exceedingly happy to have his biggest enemy banned... i mean... what to you even trying to archive?


type: message
date: 2023-01-19 23:54:18
content:
  I love watching stupid people think they are solving a problem when in reality they are making themselves look stupid. You have to have some sort of neutrality with both sides in order to try and solve something.


type: message
date: 2023-01-19 23:54:41
content:
  ...so... you basically just want the platform gone... in short... also destroying Froox's own dreams in the process of your renegade actions?
  That's... pretty selfish if I might state...
  ...and a disservice to the people who still use it.


type: message
date: 2023-01-19 23:55:01
edit_date: 2023-01-19 23:55:12
content:
  if you all was responsible you would've got a mod involved @NonnyFreedom I'm fed up of seeing reoccurring arguments for the sake of it.


type: message
date: 2023-01-19 23:55:33
content:
  I can't wait until someone drops you out of here. You aren't solving anything. You look dumb right now.


type: message
date: 2023-01-19 23:57:28
content:
  anyway, Nonny is pretty good at what they do. Andrea picked a pretty good moderator, especially since their duty curbed the heavier trolling that did occur in this channel in the past. Things have been slower, but we did enjoy the calmer situation...


type: message
date: 2023-01-19 23:57:38
edit_date: 2023-01-19 23:57:51
content:
  all involved party's just chill its been a year of reoccurring same bullshit and slushie i know your in here just to start fights and after a year of it I'm just sick of it, the game is in a standstill there is no fight never was this is a private matter that should've been handled internally but everyone thinks they know so much just sit back and relax


type: message
date: 2023-01-19 23:59:21
content:
  I've already told you to use -RiftTouch as a launch argument and clear your cache from the local install and check permissions and give me a log in the past , i have tried to help you but you have ignored me at each turn with the statement "the website version works"


type: message
date: 2023-01-20 00:00:23
content:
  Additionally... even without that argument... I tested the DK2 a few months back and... it worked fine. Used an XBox controller to move around, old school style, but I was very impressed going down memory lane again


type: message
date: 2023-01-20 00:00:54
content:
  People rarly want help, they want to be right. To be wrong means weakness and that can't happen. I am sure its the software that is at fault, that works for basicly everyone else but it sure isn't MINE!


type: message
date: 2023-01-20 00:01:34
content:
  not helping, but yes neos is a buggy mess allways has been but thats why i love it sure i hate restarting it 30 times a day just to use my face tracker and vive eye tracker


type: message
date: 2023-01-20 00:13:10
edit_date: 2023-01-20 00:13:29
content:
  tbh people keep asking me best pc to build for neos without a price limit ... but it mostly falls down to optimisations to do to vr and steam settings


type: message
date: 2023-01-20 00:14:40
edit_date: 2023-01-21 23:09:04
content:
  RTX3090, stock clocked 12900K, 64GB of DDR5 6400Mhz RAM... can get max FPS in some worlds, but only 60 in others


type: message
date: 2023-01-20 00:15:35
content:
  but if u have money ... and want loads of frames latest gpu from nvidia + AMD RYZEN™ 7 5800X3D and some fast ddr4 turn on resizeable bar in motherboard... steam advance options shown go to per application settings set throttling to fixed and max top slider leave second one install openfsr and turn up the sharpness Do not use resolution scaler in normal menu leave at 100 go to per application and change resolution per eye


type: message
date: 2023-01-20 00:18:15
edit_date: 2023-01-20 00:18:22
content:
  some people think storage plays a part in neos and considering my cache and database are not even on my pc they are on a nas i wouldnt say it does rly matter using infiniband


type: message
date: 2023-01-20 00:19:42
content:
  well... can confirm that a bit. My cache and install are on my 3x RAID setup. Sequential is 18.8 GB/s Read & 16.4 GB/s Write


type: message
date: 2023-01-20 00:28:57
content:
  If you have the problem the other way around... like having a lot of file you want to store "in neos" like extensiv worlds, videos you want to watch with people sometimes or anything bit you don't want to pay cloud storage for... ... a not well known fact about neos is that the load-world before the home world is actually completly offline


type: message
date: 2023-01-20 00:36:48
content:
  beware that the access speed will be the speed of the F drive, even if the folder appears to be on C still (as in the symlink)


type: message
date: 2023-01-20 00:39:16
content:
  I used that quite often before i had bigger M.2 disks. Moving games i no longer intend to play for the next days to another drive, without losing the ability to actually start them on demand


type: message
date: 2023-01-20 00:40:44
content:
  if you want to move it back, just delete the symlink in the explorer, without any console or cmd, and move the folder back


type: message
date: 2023-01-20 00:42:02
content:
  well, if you intend to play games that are more demanding (without making loading the main game) you can use my trick for exactly that


type: message
date: 2023-01-20 00:44:46
content:
  well, that would really be a reason for neos to make a stable mobile version, so you can at least play it with a cheap standalone vr headset ;)


type: message
date: 2023-01-20 04:48:49
content:
  Could also set the data and cache paths to be on a different drive instead of symlinking it unless there was some reason you couldn't do that? then neos is handling the whole thing and not putting much on the c drive


type: message
date: 2023-01-20 05:55:53
content:
  If you don't have link shell extension installed, explorer will recursively delete everything even following those links


type: message
date: 2023-01-20 05:57:51
content:
  Paths are stored in that local database, moving cache without deleting it is currently not implemented


type: message
date: 2023-01-20 15:33:40
content:
  I'm just mentioning as it did that before, it might have changed and the explorer be smarter to deal with symlinks


type: message
date: 2023-01-20 15:38:38
content:
  Well, i delete symlinks by explorer since around 10 years. I am pretty sure it works. But you have to delete the symlink symbol (it looks different in the explorer)


type: message
date: 2023-01-20 15:40:10
content:
  I have pretty much had directories deleted in Windows 7, that were pointed to by symlinks before, even if those symlinks were contained inside directories I deleted


type: message
date: 2023-01-20 15:41:22
content:
  Explorer used to ignore, whether it is a link or not. If it looks like a directory, then it deletes all the contents as well. This might have changed some time during Windows 10


type: message
date: 2023-01-20 21:55:46
content:
  also ccleaner.. the name i always read as cc - cleaner lol
  pretty sure doesn't do much really anymore


type: message
date: 2023-01-21 06:11:13
content:
  Hello and welcome☺️ Just a quick reminder that this is an English only channel. Just to  keep the conversation comprehensive for everyone ☺️. Many thanks for understanding 🙏☺️


type: message
date: 2023-01-21 09:31:01
content:
  Thank you. 思雨 Currently there is no Chinese group at the moment but we can definitely consider that in the future ☺️


type: message
date: 2023-01-21 15:10:22
content:
  hello all, i am new to neosvr. are there any video tutorials for setting up your own personal neosvr server, if it is at all possible?


type: message
date: 2023-01-21 15:16:27
content:
  There is a discord channel specifically for any questions relating to the headless server stuff (# headless-client). I'd check there, I recall atleast some text guides to help you get set up, not sure if there are any videos for it though. That channel is also where you get the beta key for the headless. You'll need to be supporting the Patreon at the Gunter level ($12/m) to have access to that channel and the headless.


type: message
date: 2023-01-22 00:11:37
content:
  just so your aware: a world doesn't require to be on a headless client to work. They're handy for larger load events or for shared spaces, but aren't needed to build worlds or hang out


type: message
date: 2023-01-23 10:33:22
content:
  Hi, um, I need help. I've kinda somehow locked myself out of my account I created a while back. I've forgotten the password and requested a reset email but it's not coming through... and I can't create a new account on the same email...


type: message
date: 2023-01-25 01:20:32
content:
  also @malooniac https://neos.com/features , last set of bullet points https://imgur.com/a/7YDfcYh sessions is spelt incorrectly. no clue if you have any sway with the website or that's a Karel thing just letting ya know


type: message
date: 2023-01-25 02:17:00
content:
  Design wise, the newer one is nicer.
  Ease of finding information, the old one is still rocking around in its grave.


type: message
date: 2023-01-26 04:11:08
content:
  shib's current manager invested in a metacasino and the team members disagreed with the casino. shib is a community of 10 million people


type: message
date: 2023-01-26 11:36:09
content:
  The doge is a populist, no big investors behind, only a Chavez-like leader with a limited IQ. Shib was selected and added by the whole Ethereum Empire, the intelligence and financial power behind it, elon is not an opponent at all.


type: message
date: 2023-01-26 11:39:59
content:
  The cryptocurrency space needs a micropayment tool. They have always had the vision to create a universal currency that is better than the dollar, making the dollar a scrap of paper that no one wants


type: message
date: 2023-01-27 00:20:18
content:
  In our lifetimes, we will certainly see a country like New Zealand, with the entire country operating on ethereum. And the abolition of the police.


type: message
date: 2023-01-27 01:11:07
content:
  jeez... kind of weird to read that. I didn't do VB, but I did learn a Basic clone language with a similar structure around their time, which I then pivoted to C++ via Torque and DirectX 7 coding using Win32 API directly for window management.


type: message
date: 2023-01-27 01:12:06
content:
  weirder so, back when I did compete in SkillsUSA, the person I tied with was a VB programmer, and it was the first time the competition was held at a state level for my area.


type: message
date: 2023-01-27 01:13:40
content:
  not into NFTs at all, but I can give them mad respect for doing what they did and learning the ropes the old school way. You just don't learn stuff the same way anymore.


type: message
date: 2023-01-27 01:54:22
content:
  Enjoyed that thread, thanks. A great reminder that no matter how difficult it may seem, with enough determination we can all achieve our goals💪🚀


type: message
date: 2023-01-27 08:58:42
content:
  Are you looking for a professional token lister, who can help you list your token/Token listing on CoinMarketCap or CoinGecko? Have you been frustrated listing your Token on CoinMarketCap or CoinGecko? If Yes, you're a lucky guy to reach my post. 
   
   
  I'm Sdmula by name. I have more than 5 years experience in listing token on CoinMarketCap and CoinGecko. I mainly list Token on CoinGecko, CoinMarketCap And Trust Wallet. 
  I have direct access to the listing backend which has given me the opportunity of getting all projects listed even if you're qualified. 
  I'm here to help you list your Token on Coingecko, Coinmarketcap or Trust Wallet. 
  Feel Free To Message Me For Better Discussion Regarding Your Project.


type: message
date: 2023-01-27 21:33:08
content:
  Small problem with that is the reason I don't make big games on neos is networking and performance with more than 20 users in one session pretty much nobody is getting more than 30fps


type: message
date: 2023-01-27 21:40:14
content:
  That's what's stopped me from porting ghost to neos is the performance of having that many players in a lobby as well as the fact that, well, neos community mostly don't really want to play minigames.


type: message
date: 2023-01-27 21:41:12
content:
  We have a ton of cool mini games but I never see a single session of them hosted. The last time I saw anyone play curving bullets was (aside from this week) nearly a year ago


type: message
date: 2023-01-27 23:00:51
content:
  my best guess is that people are more inclined to create and share gag items more so than do full mini games that fuller games usually do better.


type: message
date: 2023-01-27 23:02:18
content:
  hey just to let you guys know my account was compromised and the only telegram chat it is in is this one. using a false sim impersonation and its useing a second phone so the only logical conclusion it was from this chat i reccomend everyone to turn on 2fa..


type: message
date: 2023-01-27 23:03:20
content:
  Additionally, Neos is... a bit of a strange one when it comes to that. For example, in VRChat, you have worlds dedicated to certain games, like Uno, CAH, and so on. This is due to the limit of the system that content like that can only really exist in a per world situation.

  In Neos's case, such things can be... anywhere. Want to play Uno? Just grab a deck from your inventory. This dynamic approach to things means that a world may appear to not have much going on, but is, in fact, doing a lot of gaming stuff


type: message
date: 2023-01-28 07:05:41
content:
  Totally, I prefer games I can play in any world on neos too, this is why I made star realms the way I did.

  Reminds me I still need to remake star realms some day


type: message
date: 2023-01-29 11:53:30
edit_date: 2023-01-29 12:10:06
content:
  Hi I'm still working on it and Andrea has recently posted with some messages for her perspective too.


type: message
date: 2023-01-29 12:29:34
content:
  In the latest community Q&A, Binance founder CZ revealed that Cryptocurrency's next big product aims to address trust and transparency, with multiple products to be released around Cryptocurrency's Proof of Reserves and Proof of Solvency to provide a roadmap for greater transparency and public release. The product team aims to achieve 1 billion Binance certified users by further streamlining the KYC process.
  Regarding plans to build a meta-universe, CZ said that if Binance builds a meta-universe, it will definitely be supported by BNB. Mayur Kamat, head of product at Binance, revealed that this year could bring more "Binance-powered metaversees".


type: message
date: 2023-01-29 17:55:04
content:
  But is the team still actively working on this project?

  The last pinned post is since September.

  Last I checked, team was having internal issues. Not sure how that turns out


type: message
date: 2023-01-29 21:01:39
content:
  I won't be sharing further information as always you can find information in pinned messages here our website or the discord announcements channel


type: message
date: 2023-01-30 02:32:07
content:
  yeah. That was something I do miss with the older site: it had everything treated equally, even NCR. It was short, simple, and clean.


type: message
date: 2023-01-30 03:12:14
content:
  Why do I keep seeing NCR and think NMS, and then start thinking of mockup names like "Yes PaperBill Star"?


type: message
date: 2023-01-30 03:51:43
content:
  Yeah. This is the second time they've been shutdown. The first was, ironically, halted due to Microsoft acquiring them. Judging from the quick reading I've done (namely, not a lot), it seems some parts are being shifted to something called Microsoft Mesh... which feels like an odd take of a mesh network.


type: message
date: 2023-01-30 03:51:45
content:
  I think they want to focus on Microsoft Mesh the way I understand it but yes, it's a little sad. I used to like it. It was very friendly community in general.


type: message
date: 2023-01-30 03:53:49
content:
  my only guess is if they were after some design systems or whatever. There are features that AltSpace offered that aren't present in other platforms, including Neos. There's some trickery that could be done to mimic them, but it'd be very flaky.


type: message
date: 2023-01-30 04:40:23
content:
  I agree with you. AltSpace is/was a fantastic platform for hosting events and larger-scale meetings. 
  Although I do not have a deep understanding of the technology behind it I believe you could host hundreds of people at a time. I personally enjoyed stuff like  weekly group meditations and it was surprisingly engaging given the low-quality graphics. (Here we would absolutely rule😄)


type: message
date: 2023-01-30 04:42:29
content:
  You're assuming I was fired which is incorrect, for everything else. I'm simply not gonna talk about it here. If you'd like to learn more I dunno Linked In InMail me or something.


type: message
date: 2023-01-30 04:44:14
content:
  Now I think since they will shut down, many users will be looking for alternative platforms - I see that a lot of them are looking at VR Chat because of cross-platform compatibility. Understandably as I know that a lot of people I met on there actually preferred the desktop mode. 
  So VR Chat might be sufficient for now however, I think the ease of use of AltSpace is/was something that VR Chat (and current Neos) still lack and so our focus on devices like the Quest and user friendliness etc. is really mandatory. (And probably in general is to any social VR platform).


type: message
date: 2023-01-30 04:46:10
content:
  I'm not asking to mirror AltSpace, though that'd be a nice thing. Part of what made it work, I feel, was the low quality graphics, since it didn't require a lot of memory to store everything. This was how events with 'hundreds' of users actually worked: it was secretly many sessions, with the host/presenter given the ability to see specific notifications (hand raises) and switch to those sessions seamlessly.


type: message
date: 2023-01-30 04:46:39
content:
  Neos has session functionality, but it's hindered by high memory requirements and the lack of seamlessness unless you use the same conditions.


type: message
date: 2023-01-30 04:47:48
content:
  The only hurdle, at that point, is syncing the host's audio and movements across all sessions natively. A humble Logix setup could allow mirroring via websockets from the host to the other sessions, but that'd be fairly janky.


type: message
date: 2023-01-30 08:02:59
content:
  Hi chenlong , there is no official Chinese group as of now sorry, but it's definitely something we could take a look at in the future:)


type: message
date: 2023-01-30 12:06:35
content:
  I'm starting to slowly realize I'm using Neos more of a BigScreen alternative: https://fxtwitter.com/FlameSoulis/status/1619980049247277058


type: message
date: 2023-01-30 14:24:28
content:
  I know that there were already multiple Ideas on how to battle massive worlds or usercounts in Neos.
  You could probably poke Geenz about them. 
  One for example is to have multiple "root points" to get around the floating point error issue.
  Multiple server hosting aswell and meshed networkload.
  The current Dedicated server is also not public yet due to it being in development.
  Which is stuck.


type: message
date: 2023-01-30 14:29:02
content:
  So far neos has no issues with bottlenecks. Mostly because the player host, or the dedicated servers (in development yes, but used often)
  Main traffic are assets and they are downloaded from azure cloud (i think) so everything is scaleable


type: message
date: 2023-01-30 14:39:27
edit_date: 2023-01-30 20:27:10
content:
  You do have multiple bottlenecks, depending on the situations.

  Network bottleneck - due to the design, the traffic raises still exponantially I think, depending on how many users there are. And how much they spawn into the world that did not came from the cloud.
  (Host needs to download it first before it gets sended to everyone else)

  CPU bottleneck - The IK is still quite heavy, which is why the IK culling mod already helps a fair bit. Same goes for overall culling. 
  But a server can also start to go down and everything starts to queue up.

  VRam bottleneck - We dont really have LoD systems yet. And neos has no automization for that.


type: message
date: 2023-01-30 15:51:24
content:
  Thats all single-world bottlenecks. Has nothing to do with neos as a network. Its a question how many users can be in one world that can only be answered by asset, world, physics and engine optimization


type: message
date: 2023-01-30 15:53:10
content:
  VrChat answers that question by having very low res assets and world. Also basicly no physics or complex game engine. That allows for more player but less creativity


type: message
date: 2023-01-30 18:29:57
content:
  cost of bigger user limits
  i already can't handle more than a few people so its not really a big downside for neos..


type: message
date: 2023-01-30 20:30:56
content:
  Hmmm... That's debatable regarding assets. A poorly built world made in both Neos or VRC will still be poor in performance, just Neos will be slower in almost all cases. At that point, improvements to the engine itself would be the deciding factor, which was explained above regarding the usual culprits.


type: message
date: 2023-01-30 20:32:47
content:
  Remember that improvements to single world operations also impacts larger scale concepts, which all platforms have to contend with.


type: message
date: 2023-01-31 00:32:53
content:
  🚀 Check out Neos Credits $NCR prices @CoinGecko!✨🦎 https://www.coingecko.com/en/coins/neos-credits?utm_source=screenshot&utm_medium=app


type: message
date: 2023-01-31 03:06:46
content:
  After checking, I think it's in reference to the website's listing of communication offerings, which lists the Discord, Reddit, Twitter, Facebook (blegh), and Bitcointalk listings, while stating the sourcecode is somehow on Github (it isn't).


type: message
date: 2023-01-31 03:08:39
content:
  However, I find the request to switch from Discord to Telegram... humorous. I've debated making a polled message to ask how many people here have actually tried Neos, since my standing opinion seems to remain unchallenged where most that remain here are either bots or have zero interest with the system itself and only care about a precious digital metal.


type: message
date: 2023-01-31 03:09:32
content:
  I state such, because the Discord is where the platform seems to display and act upon the life of the platform, while here... there's nothing really to display.


type: message
date: 2023-01-31 13:25:35
content:
  A person who holds cryptocurrency, which you seem extremely unreliable, but whose actions do not cause aggression or distress to others, then no one else has the right to accuse him. It's none of your business.


type: message
date: 2023-01-31 22:15:53
edit_date: 2023-02-01 06:37:46
content:
  My head hurts trying to read this...
  I have a healthy amount of NCR, more than enough to give myself and friends enough storage to last a good while, and would have easily made for some nice rewards had I cashed out.
  I've presented I'm also in-world, constructing and tinkering with things, given that NCR is (at this time) Neos's currency (other than KFC). Given NCR has no real value with its platform, being a user of said platform, and a holder of tokens for the platform...
  Fairly confident it is very much in my business to question such as much as anyone else would.


type: message
date: 2023-02-01 09:08:33
edit_date: 2023-02-01 09:16:58
content:
  Hi! We appreciate your excitement about the staking launch, thank you! 😊
  We also totally understand that it's a highly anticipated event and we really share the enthusiasm.
  However, as much as we would love to announce the launch already, we believe it is important to ensure that everything is in place before any announcement - so that we can deliver a safe and seamless experience to all users. So thank you for remaining patient on this. 🙏
  We will be sure to share updates as soon as the time is right, together with an explanation of staking process and conditions etc. ✨


type: message
date: 2023-02-01 11:52:12
content:
  It's been around for a small while, but there were issues with some demos being done from what I remember talking to them last.


type: message
date: 2023-02-01 11:53:12
content:
  If you check the links, they're all in reference to AI processing functions and how they could be incorporated into Neos.


type: message
date: 2023-02-01 12:00:38
content:
  I've just been busy with the YUR reader project, which adds fitness data to Neos from the YUR service.


type: message
date: 2023-02-01 12:03:54
content:
  I think chatgpt is extremely cool, but i anticipate a lot of development related to this in the next 5 to 8 years. We might already reach the singularity by then. And long before have bitesized models in game that dont require web services


type: message
date: 2023-02-01 12:04:56
content:
  In fact, current similar models take about 10gb storage and the calculation power of a normal pc for 1 answer per 50 seconds


type: message
date: 2023-02-01 13:17:39
content:
  I really understand your frustration and that nothing that myself or Karel say will ultimately change the way you feel, but I still must emphasize that during negotiation periods (in case of Neos, still ongoing) it is normal not to disclose information in order to protect all parties involved.  
  Once the time is right, there will be a plenty of evidence that the project is moving forwards. Until then please just understand that everyone is very passionate about future development of Neos and therefore doing their best within posibilities. I would not bother writing these messages otherwise as I am aware that I sound like a broken record.


type: message
date: 2023-02-01 13:19:37
edit_date: 2023-02-01 13:38:52
content:
  Also, while I completely understand where you come from and yes, people trusted the project and are indeed very much invested in its future, in this context, I would suggest to use the term "holders" rather than "investors" because buying a token doesn't necessarily involve investment in a traditional sense. And we have to be careful with this because crypto is a highly speculative thing so people might misunderstand or get a wrong idea if we talk about "investment".


type: message
date: 2023-02-01 15:19:07
edit_date: 2023-02-01 15:19:23
content:
  buying NCR when you don't need it for in-game storage is obviously a speculation, you don't need a lawyer for that


type: message
date: 2023-02-01 17:04:15
edit_date: 2023-02-01 19:33:12
content:
  I know that for tax reasons, having it be opt-out could result in users who abandoned their accounts to be put in trouble at no fault of their own. Additionally, it'd bring to question if any 'staked' value can be utilized in-world or if it is settled into its own setup.


type: message
date: 2023-02-01 19:32:47
content:
  I asked about it being opt-in, due to complications about how tax works on crypto in some countries. I got as much as a thinking about it answer, if I remember correctly


type: message
date: 2023-02-01 21:47:19
edit_date: 2023-02-05 00:36:12
content:
  atleast appreciate that they're the only ones who care about "investors" not getting left behind or more accurately, blatantly scammed.


type: message
date: 2023-02-01 21:49:03
content:
  thought I don't think its wrong to call them investors either. Froox himself said specicially NCR was an investment


type: message
date: 2023-02-01 21:51:44
content:
  Probably more just the issue of being an investor of crypto. And not the company itself. Something about there being investor protections which don't apply here, if I recall correctly


type: message
date: 2023-02-01 21:53:21
content:
  > Nothing detailed within this white paper and/or the associated website should be deemed to
  constitute a prospectus of any sort of solicitation for investment, nor does it, in any way, pertain to an
  offering or a solicitation of an owner to buy any securities in any jurisdiction.


type: message
date: 2023-02-02 09:41:29
content:
  May I ask who is the right person to discuss regarding partnership? I am with Galaxy Arena Metaverse. Thanks in advance


type: message
date: 2023-02-02 09:48:39
edit_date: 2023-02-02 09:48:53
content:
  No worries. But at the moment there is a situation where the two owners... negotiate about the ownership of neos (code and brand) It might be that business partner ships are not the highest priority and answers can take longer possibly


type: message
date: 2023-02-02 12:05:24
content:
  What will happen to NCR tokens? Will Frooxius support NCR in the near future? Can we still trust Karel and Frooxius?


type: message
date: 2023-02-02 14:59:32
content:
  Karel doesn't have any issues with NCR, actually it's completely the opposite as he is putting in his best effort to make there is still a bright future for Neos and NCR. As for Froox, I cannot speak for him, or anyone from the team, but I don't think they're inherently against NCR either. There have been other issues between the founders and the team that have been discussed here and everywhere too many times, including various sci-fi theories, and I think everyone is tired of hearing about it, just as they're tired of hearing me say "we're working hard behind the scenes, remain patient."😁


type: message
date: 2023-02-02 15:12:13
content:
  As for this, I believe I've pretty much answered this in the DM you have sent. Updates/announcements will be provided when it's the right time - so unfortunately I am unable to give details, but if you would like to get the official stance - Karel's statements can be found pinned in this chat, and I believe Frooxius is usually active in Neos Discord community. ☺️


type: message
date: 2023-02-02 15:17:55
edit_date: 2023-02-02 15:18:33
content:
  😁 Karel is for sure busy but he does grant the occasional audience. Prolonged periods of silence make his rare and divine appearance more impactful 😁


type: message
date: 2023-02-02 16:48:11
content:
  The issue is between those personalities but for some WEIRD reason Froox decided he'd take the dispute out on the people who bought NCR and helped fund the project. We still don't know why other than that all his devs, friends and bf hate crypto and see this dispute as an opportunity to remove it.


type: message
date: 2023-02-02 16:51:58
content:
  Froox himself hasn't said that specifically, probably for legal reasons but everyone in his peripheral have been pretty open about it


type: message
date: 2023-02-02 16:54:19
content:
  So when people ask about NCR, if its dead or not, we should be upfront and honest about it and what each side's intentions are


type: message
date: 2023-02-03 19:38:17
content:
  we do share your feelings, but can do nothing until the mather is resolved in the speed of the law... as in very slowly obviously


type: message
date: 2023-02-04 16:41:06
content:
  also, just got an email from Sansar regarding investment inquiries, with a rather interesting quote:
  "Many platforms have become obsolete by focusing too much on VR and ignoring the billions of users who don't have VR rigs."
  They've even taken jabs at VRChat ... though they spelled it wrong.


type: message
date: 2023-02-04 16:43:42
content:
  oh, and they claim that this is also to establish "the first true monetizable VR metaverse"... despite the earlier quote.


type: message
date: 2023-02-05 06:49:29
content:
  not sure. The devs that made the service are just happy to see their system being used. I just wanted the heartrate data.


type: message
date: 2023-02-05 07:18:54
content:
  most I've seen are cardio, with no weights. There's a group that does it often in VRC, who has poed me about the system I've been working on


type: message
date: 2023-02-05 08:01:36
content:
  Keep me posted. I am a ninja fitness expert and have created several fitness apps. Can give you advice if you get stuck on workout design


type: message
date: 2023-02-05 08:07:27
content:
  I'm not sure what I could do, since I'm mostly making the YUR fitness data available to in-world services. I just got 'burnRate' working, which seems to be calories per minute (since the calMin value mrrored the results). It could be used to observe pace and what not


type: message
date: 2023-02-05 10:38:57
content:
  YUR is a VR fitness service that translates motion data from VR activities into calories burned. https://www.yur.energy/


type: message
date: 2023-02-05 10:43:42
content:
  which is ultimately what I needed, since the SDK stuff is great if you are making a game to supply data for... but not very helpful if you just want the numbers displayed


type: message
date: 2023-02-05 13:16:48
content:
  The twitter will have any updates the team feel the need to share. That's a different question though. You asked if it was dead and you can search for messages from Karel and Andrea here etc.


type: message
date: 2023-02-05 15:03:58
edit_date: 2023-02-05 15:04:49
content:
  The project is alive, but there cannot be any updates published for the time being. Also there's a situation that forbids announcing any news temporarily. Hopefully being resolved soon.


type: message
date: 2023-02-05 17:22:31
content:
  One has clearly never played a megaman title: there's always more than 2 bosses (but clearly cheese is OP and was never nerfed in development)


type: message
date: 2023-02-05 17:27:41
content:
  It's complicated. You can find out more by visiting the Discord and checking its announcements, in addition to the pinned comments in this Telegram.


type: message
date: 2023-02-06 16:50:11
edit_date: 2023-02-06 21:35:34
content:
  CEO was little too hands off when it came to allowing volunteers to work on the project and they are now trying to take the project over with CTO. Community has no clue of what the future of Neos will be


type: message
date: 2023-02-07 03:34:49
edit_date: 2023-02-07 03:36:19
content:
  Is Karel  and CTO in positive discussion? Just tell me if it's positive or negative. I want to see if there is any progress that is reaching an agreement.


type: message
date: 2023-02-07 13:54:38
content:
  on the other hand seems pretty clear that not many people think ncr is valued anywhere close to that


type: message
date: 2023-02-07 23:18:33
content:
  I mean, the devs were transparent with updates back in announcements when new bug fixes and features were completed. Any lack of transparency would be due to the disagreement, where neither party can't really say much


type: message
date: 2023-02-07 23:21:42
content:
  Of which you can still read up in the Discord. In fact, much of the reason for things being 'opaque' are in the announcements as well, in addition to updates on the platform's systems


type: message
date: 2023-02-08 03:07:12
content:
  without the devs, you don't have a platform and thus the idea and concept of NCR is equally lost. Neos can live without the coin, but the coin cannot live without Neos.


type: message
date: 2023-02-08 03:14:32
content:
  Neos can hire other capable developers. Metaverse needs to be decentralized and blockchain is needed for that.


type: message
date: 2023-02-08 03:30:14
content:
  not... really... even then, due to the engine's complexity, there'd be a large chunk of time just to have a "new team" figure out the code to begin with.


type: message
date: 2023-02-08 03:31:34
content:
  People seem to forget that Neos isn't centralized, nor tied to requiring a connection, which a blockchain integration would effectively ruin. In irony, doing such would make Neos more centralized than the claim to make it decentralized.


type: message
date: 2023-02-08 13:36:13
edit_date: 2023-02-08 15:11:41
content:
  Yes, Neos in particular started as a decentralized metaverse, however with the inclusion of accounts and the cloud storage, it is very centralized nowadays and it would break if the services are shut down, yet, it can still continue to exist in the old decentralized form as those features still exist. Hosting worlds is still decentralized, just mentioning as that's an argument why Neos is thought to be still decentralized. However inventory, accounts, and asset distribution is centralized.
  Now... using blockchain has a point, as that can put accounts onto a decentralized roster, which is the blockchain, binding accounts to wallets. Assets could be put onto IPFS to be decentralized. But, inventory, I don't know, that'd be more like something you store for yourself and keep backup copies. Yet all this still doesn't require NCR as a token.
  So, question to those knowing about blockchain technology and what a DAO is. What would NCR be used for? Any use case would be nice. I have some NCR and I'd really like to have use for this.


type: message
date: 2023-02-08 13:44:04
content:
  It was invented as a thank you for supporters, at a point where neos could give nothing more then this symbolic token


type: message
date: 2023-02-08 13:47:51
content:
  Its an ingame currency. Like wow gold, with the difference that it cant be created from thin air. Its usecase is convenience as trades are done by neos. There are no perks


type: message
date: 2023-02-08 13:49:58
content:
  In the end its an ingame currency. Its value is its limited nature, convenience and whatever feature can be bought with it, like storage


type: message
date: 2023-02-08 13:51:12
content:
  However it needs more perks for NCR to be valuable in the future. Most likely some even need to be NCR exclusive


type: message
date: 2023-02-08 13:51:32
content:
  But thats the only thing so far. It may be worth a lot more at a point where more features are offered, like implementation with an ingame shop


type: message
date: 2023-02-08 13:52:11
content:
  The perks would have to emulate a sink where NCR goes back to the creators. Storage is one of those perks that works that way


type: message
date: 2023-02-08 13:54:38
content:
  That's why I'm asking for ideas, what perks could be implemented NCR only. They would be provided by Neos and could only be acquired by spending NCR. They would be available to everyone, because NCR can be traded. This would give NCR some value back and holders would be rewarded


type: message
date: 2023-02-08 13:55:58
content:
  And if people don't want to touch NCR, selling those perks could be outsourced to third parties, who would resell those perks to users and the service would spend NCR they would have to buy on the market


type: message
date: 2023-02-08 13:59:49
content:
  However, I'm afraid that even suggesting there being NCR exclusive perks will get me on the bad side


type: message
date: 2023-02-08 14:01:11
content:
  Fair, so yea, good idea to some point. But i am of the opinion that any exclusive is bad, very bad. Killer of Innovation and the opposite of neos and the idea of decentralized systems


type: message
date: 2023-02-08 14:02:46
content:
  if i twist my words i can say that buying storage without any real money involved is a pure ncr exclusive experience


type: message
date: 2023-02-08 14:05:10
content:
  Doesnt make it a good idea or complient with the idea of an open, decentralized space of equal opportunity


type: message
date: 2023-02-08 14:08:02
content:
  well yea.. by the time you get to buy storage with ncr it is on a central ledger
  neither is the storage decentralized


type: message
date: 2023-02-08 14:09:40
content:
  neos already allowes p2p asset transfer if you've uploaded something that then only exists within that session
  and it's notably incredibly worse performing


type: message
date: 2023-02-08 14:19:38
content:
  i would be interested in it as a *fallback* mode though
  no server is 100% reliable
  others' computers even less, but maybe you can trust your own judgment to keep your local copy of storage safe


type: message
date: 2023-02-08 14:42:46
content:
  Because of the recent spike in cryptocurrency, the twenty-somethings I've met recently are looking for pfp avatars like azuki, bayc. They are all willing to pay $5w for a cool avatar.


type: message
date: 2023-02-08 15:01:00
edit_date: 2023-02-08 15:30:32
content:
  those are some bold claims
  you've certainty never experienced the power of purchasing storage with ncr..


type: message
date: 2023-02-08 15:42:42
edit_date: 2023-02-08 15:43:23
content:
  However, if only storage is a perk to buy with NCR, then all the funds from minting might only be allocated to pay for the cloud storage services, why would it go to development then?


type: message
date: 2023-02-08 15:51:32
edit_date: 2023-02-08 15:53:51
content:
  Mints happened recently, so yes, the mints are happening. They usually happen at the beginning of the month.


type: message
date: 2023-02-08 16:12:35
content:
  Correct me if I'm wrong, but due to how Neos operates (something I'm confident only a small percentage of this chat know of), if say things were to use say the IPFS with a financial incentive backing of NCR or whatever... and bear in mind, I haven't dabbled with IPFS directly but recall people running HTTP gateways in the past to load content, so I get the general idea... wouldn't each small change constitute as a transaction? Given that ANY change, such as a small movement of an object to a humble logix node, would all count... wouldn't that create a barrier to entry of content creation, thus defeating the entire point of the platform itself?


type: message
date: 2023-02-08 17:42:32
edit_date: 2023-02-14 06:38:57
content:
  Well, with IPFS you could pin the assets on your PC, so as long as your PC is logged into IPFS it can serve the assets and others who download the assets would cache them for some limited time and also server those. What you could do is, pay others to also pin those assets, so they are available if your PC and all those other nodes that cache those assets are unavailable


type: message
date: 2023-02-08 17:43:08
content:
  That also means like, you don't even need to bother with caching assets, as IPFS is doing that very well already


type: message
date: 2023-02-08 19:25:56
content:
  For assets, Neos implements an asset transfer system utilizing the local:// uri. It streams content over the LNL protocol between the host and clients. It is used any time an asset is uploaded into a Neos world or when an asset is regenerated in world (like a texture/mesh modification, or taking a photo). It would be pretty smooth to be able to utilize that as a means of reducing egress and ingress traffic from the cloud and host, and also to make Neos more mesh-like allowing clients to stream content directly to other clients.


type: message
date: 2023-02-08 19:26:59
content:
  But given how cheap egress bandwidth and cloud storage has become, it doesn't seem like it's a problem that warrants solving, unless you really want a fully p2p Metaverse


type: message
date: 2023-02-08 19:28:15
content:
  Upload of the normal internet user is very low. Like often 1/10 of their download. Neos does have and use asset streaming and if you invite someone to your local world (not home world, but the loading world) you can test this by only having assets there that are nowhere else safed (only in this loading world)


type: message
date: 2023-02-08 19:28:46
content:
  They will stay local only saved on your pc and streamed. But it is obviously very limited expecially if we talk about more then 1 or 2 guests


type: message
date: 2023-02-08 19:31:44
content:
  As long as the URI didn't change, the Neos caching should still apply for revisits to the same world but I personally have not validated that. It certainly does help on hosted cloud sessions


type: message
date: 2023-02-08 19:33:29
content:
  Well, you can test that this way. Usually things sooner or later get uploaded to the cloud, expecially if you save or leave that world


type: message
date: 2023-02-08 19:53:25
content:
  I mean... you can already also use http within Neos, which can be self hosted or otherwise. The problem I'm seeing also reoccurring is trust. Some people here do not enjoy the concept of a central hosting system, and others have issues with trusting hosting to everyone... which is fair, because let's face it: bad actors are always going to be a thing.


type: message
date: 2023-02-08 19:55:50
content:
  Depends on the collaboration. Any critical Neos related business inquiries should be sent to hello@neos.com.


type: message
date: 2023-02-08 19:56:54
content:
  Continuing on: IMO, I feel doing something akin to Mastodon instances might be a nice way to have a happy balance... but with recent news, I do concur that the concept is also confusing to people who are wanting to just jump in and look around. Neos does have a slightly higher bar to entry, so I think the central cloud system will be around for a very long while... which, ironically speaking, is also the only way to download the application in the first place so...


type: message
date: 2023-02-08 20:09:31
content:
  Correct, but say the version with 'all features available' is the one that matters (I begrudgingly say that), then it is only available from... a central web server. It is backed by Cloudflare with a CDN, but I'm not sure where the files are grabbed from with the launcher.


type: message
date: 2023-02-09 22:48:03
content:
  If you are interested, you can go to the offline event of the Ethereum. They're having an event in Denver on February 24th.


type: message
date: 2023-02-10 00:46:49
content:
  The standalone launcher downloads this .7z file, then unpacks it: https://assets.neos.com/install/Pro/Data/2022.1.28.1310_MMC21_2.7z

  It finds what version to download by checking this link first: https://cloudxstorage.blob.core.windows.net/install/Pro/Public


type: message
date: 2023-02-10 17:03:48
content:
  I was about to say... the memes of building more important worlds to vibe in have been going around like nuts


type: message
date: 2023-02-10 22:59:57
content:
  I'll dig up the name, but there was a group that had started working on one and they had made some pretty good progress but I don't think they ever published it


type: message
date: 2023-02-12 00:44:28
content:
  I don't think the Patreon 'mints' cause 'mints' to occur on the blockchain as well, at least every time


type: message
date: 2023-02-13 15:37:50
edit_date: 2023-02-13 15:41:14
content:
  Solemnly declare: NCR has failed, and there is no chance. Everyone has been cheated. Now someone has jointly prosecuted. Please contact me.


type: message
date: 2023-02-13 15:44:07
content:
  We hold NCR, we participated in the ICO 2 years ago to finance Neos. Now NCR is worthless and we don't know what to do with it. There is no information indicating Neos Credits will develop in the future.


type: message
date: 2023-02-13 18:56:29
content:
  Froox blew his chance, I hope he's busy building a new platform or he'll regret this in his older days


type: message
date: 2023-02-13 20:04:13
edit_date: 2023-02-13 20:15:02
content:
  That sounds like a you issue, honestly. This means you have no clue what you really "invested" in and are now upset because you won't get a return. You took the gamble and lost.
  People who actually use the platform are able to continue to use the system, regardless of the coin's value. Unlike other services, there's a functional use for the coin, which has frequently been used.
  Maybe actually try to look around what you are pushing capital into. In two years, there were many events on Neos that could have boosted the value, especially with partnered events, and the value didn't change.


type: message
date: 2023-02-13 22:05:15
edit_date: 2023-02-13 22:10:15
content:
  NCR was never an investment token. It was something to mint to support development of Neos with a possible utility in return. It was to give Neos users a way to support Neos and maybe get something nice in return. Also NCR was thought to be an in game trading currency that could be used to pay for many different things. It could have worked as a kind of investment thing, and frankly I tried to invest some in it as well, however it was never meant to be that. Then came people minting NCR with the intent to sell at ATH, that gave the big rise and hope but then that huge drop and disappointment in the token. Of course some people lost interest in that token, when this pump and dump happened. I still hope for some recovery and for developments that would extend the utility of NCR. Got to see what the future will show


type: message
date: 2023-02-13 22:27:21
edit_date: 2023-02-13 23:07:06
content:
  I really hope for a future for NCR and the developers considering supporting the token and getting finance for development in return


type: message
date: 2023-02-15 13:46:02
edit_date: 2023-02-15 13:51:00
content:
  Hello, Great day, who could I speak about marketing proposal? Im the Marketing Manager of one of the  famous KOL here in the Philippines we do promote NFTs and crypto-related projects along with your socmed, on YouTube, Twitter, and telegram, may I know who could I speak about it?


type: message
date: 2023-02-16 04:48:26
content:
  What are you even talking about? The current situation is about two friends with a side-project under a company name... until suddenly so much money was involved that everything got so complicated that the two friends are now two enemies


type: message
date: 2023-02-16 04:49:06
content:
  So now they have to split, but how do you do this with your new enemy? By law... and law takes a lot of time for everything


type: message
date: 2023-02-16 06:17:15
content:
  One more prove that you have no idea what you even talking about. You should ask around, perhaps you will figure out why i have this avatar in the end. Or you do as you always do, speak out of pure ignorance


type: message
date: 2023-02-16 07:16:44
content:
  Hmm... actually, how much of Solarix is involved with the other projects prior to the FrooxEngine/NeosVR? I'm guessing quite a few?
  I wonder how much those projects, as insignificant as they are, technically are also slowing things down, because even they have to be considered if the split has to be handled in a legal matter.


type: message
date: 2023-02-16 07:19:24
content:
  Regardless, attempting to play at contentious rumors as a basis of banter will not make anything go faster, nor make the end result feel any better once it does eventually come


type: message
date: 2023-02-16 12:51:24
content:
  Court cases take a long time always in Europe i found out in the Netherlands such a thing can take 3 years


type: message
date: 2023-02-16 15:39:41
edit_date: 2023-02-18 20:24:11
content:
  well... there's clearly SOMETHING going on or there'd be more information. You don't have both parties go 'hush hush' without someone having a lawyer.


type: message
date: 2023-02-16 15:43:58
content:
  Just because a person says something you don't like magically makes them go away. That means things are going to be continuing a lot longer, if anything...


type: message
date: 2023-02-16 18:25:38
content:
  doing alright. Getting ready to jump in and complete more work on my YUR fitness reader. Trying to figure a way to best display the kCal delta on  and how to recreate the YUR.watch accessory.


type: message
date: 2023-02-17 03:24:15
content:
  "You Do As You Always Do" My Activity Is Sparse I Am Not Sure What You Are Referring To But That Does Not Match Reality


type: message
date: 2023-02-17 04:06:41
edit_date: 2023-02-17 04:07:12
content:
  Wow, you have no idea what i am referring to. If you could see my face, thats a face without any surprise on it.


type: message
date: 2023-02-17 04:11:26
edit_date: 2023-02-17 04:23:57
content:
  But yes, perhaps i am a bit of an asshole, so what do you think why does my avatar has a paci in his mouth. You tried multiple times to make this your greatest argument against me for no reason, i am curious, literally hoping to shut me up with it (hehe) instead of making an actual point. What do you think is going on?


type: message
date: 2023-02-17 21:55:49
content:
  Is there a list of appropriate hashtags for questions? I'm trying to work on fitness resources for VR platforms and currently and actively operate on the VRChat platform and even in light of the recent on goings, I'm curious about Neos as a platform to host and house as a platform to increase general use-cases for it as we expand.


type: message
date: 2023-02-17 22:00:04
content:
  You can ask things here as well but there is a significantly more people on the discord along with a lot of questions already answered and being searchable


type: message
date: 2023-02-17 22:01:45
content:
  Fair, I was just reading the rules wiki after reading Karel's Statement to the community so I wanted to make sure I had full understanding of how this specific Telegram community was under operation. Thank you for your input.


type: message
date: 2023-02-17 23:06:06
content:
  There's alot of things that I need to ask the moderation team and probably owners of the project here in regards to VR ethics as well as use case technology that should be addressed in regards to bringing major production and actual tangible currency to the platform for services and thing associated. 

  I appreciate the input of course.


type: message
date: 2023-02-17 23:12:37
content:
  If you want to ask the moderation team, they have office hours weekly for open questions or submit a moderation inquiry ticket which will give you an authoritative response from them.


type: message
date: 2023-02-17 23:15:13
content:
  I'm in conversation with some of the dev team as we speak as they are giving some light into the platform and how it runs. I appreciate the directions being given. I am hoping to hear from someone. Anyone here about the platform from an ownership or leadership position respectfully as what I'm building would require some important aspects of what and how neos is operated to ensure the protection and safety of my user base as it continues to expand. 
  Your input is appreciated.


type: message
date: 2023-02-17 23:17:06
edit_date: 2023-02-19 03:18:24
content:
  Contracts aren't something I'd discuss in a telegram group based environment, I'm just here to see how operations are run.


type: message
date: 2023-02-18 02:20:29
content:
  Are you sure you're talking to a Dev Team member though? We have a lot of people here and sometimes it can be confusing. We've had issues before where people have assumed they were talking to team members but were actually speaking to Mentors or Moderators or even community members, which has lead to some confusing conversations sometimes.


type: message
date: 2023-02-19 03:22:20
content:
  With the timing of which it was presented it seemed as though to be a response to something I was typing, my apologizes for the confusion.


type: message
date: 2023-02-19 13:34:25
content:
  well if the name doesn't match one on this list with some kind of proof then its not a team member 
  Aegis_wolf
  Dante
  Frooxius
  Geenz
  Lacy-Bean
  Nexulan
  Rue Shejn
  Shifty
  Theo
  Outsider
  Ryuvi
  Canadian Git
  ProbablePrime
  Veer
  Andrea Maloney


type: message
date: 2023-02-19 15:05:31
content:
  Sure deal, I've made sure of it both in discord and on the neos platform  as for now with things my plan is to wait for a bit longer before any sort of specific further conversations I want to have. It's been a while since I've been on neos (about 2 years)


type: message
date: 2023-02-20 03:01:26
content:
  Eh... might as well post something made in the platform: https://twitter.com/FlameSoulis/status/1627481417205653504


type: message
date: 2023-02-20 03:04:23
content:
  actually, not really. I designated one of the tracks to be the 'master' and have the positions on all the others resync every 0.5 seconds. This was done as a precaution, but overall, it worked out just fine


type: message
date: 2023-02-22 00:32:06
content:
  No... as always, any important updates will be pinned in this channel and announcements in the Discord.


type: message
date: 2023-02-22 09:59:30
edit_date: 2023-02-22 14:08:20
content:
  hmm... I just noticed something, but I would ruin any data if I explain it, so silence will be my ambassador


type: message
date: 2023-02-23 04:52:47
content:
  BlackRock is offering an exchange-traded fund (ETF) that will focus primarily on tech companies that are exposed to the metaverse.


type: message
date: 2023-02-23 04:59:56
edit_date: 2023-02-24 02:31:01
content:
  Considering the complications of the platform, I'm doubtful that the exchange would want to be involved until after a solid foundation has been established, for which there has not been.


type: message
date: 2023-02-24 01:40:07
edit_date: 2023-02-24 04:13:07
content:
  The countries are quite close to each other, so cross cultural people exist and are usually awesome.


type: message
date: 2023-02-24 03:53:01
content:
  These guys are like a bunch of scammers, they say they're working hard, but nothing has happened in the past year.


type: message
date: 2023-02-24 04:12:03
content:
  alot of the work happens behind closed doors but maybe you find a few open sessions (or just look at whats already published)


type: message
date: 2023-02-24 04:14:51
content:
  Karel @malooniac I don't think these guys have anything to do with MMC23. Do they even have access to Neos?


type: message
date: 2023-02-24 04:17:29
content:
  Thanks!

  That's correct the main neos team are not members of the MMC team.

  As for access to Neos, I dont know what you mean.


type: message
date: 2023-02-24 06:57:23
content:
  It's like being at a concert and realizing you're better off just dancing and cheering in the crowd instead of trying to out-sing Matt Bellamy * (*replace with whatever artist is relevant to you or silently judge my music taste 😁) 

  We are cheering to all amazing MMC creators and we are always happy to see so many people having a great time in Neos ✨💙☺️.


type: message
date: 2023-02-24 08:49:54
content:
  Interestingly, doing nothing is not nearly as easy as people make it. Should I ever succeed in being absolutely zen idle, you will be the first to know.😉


type: message
date: 2023-02-24 09:12:04
content:
  That was a really good pun! thats your job. Now I see, it's your job to just give a lame answer on Telegram.


type: message
date: 2023-02-24 09:40:59
content:
  What a smart person you are ☺️ Now when we have cleared it I hope we can move on back to more interesting topics that I’d hope that exist. 🤞


type: message
date: 2023-02-24 10:35:14
edit_date: 2023-02-24 13:16:06
content:
  Why would you want to market a product, that is still more like an early alpha. However, Neos VR is very useable as it is today. It might not be friendly to new users, but once the initial hurdles are passed, it is an awesome experience. My guess is, that marketing comes later, when these quirks are worked out.


type: message
date: 2023-02-24 15:37:11
content:
  Actually, the NCR has been thought of being a way of early financing of the project. Whatever has been minted would have been used to pay for development. It came unexpectedly that Facebook changed to Meta and all the metaverse currencies going up. However this was just bubbles about to pop any time, and it did. That's why there have been those buy backs to not do a rug pull like that, it was more like a "reversing" the minting, which can actually finance the whole Neos project at a later time, given there would be an agreement on how to proceed with NCR and providing utility that can be paid with NCR. That way I guess millions could be made available to funding Neos VR in the long term, thanks to the buy backs.


type: message
date: 2023-02-27 06:18:43
content:
  GM admin. I'm Joshua, Business Development & Strategic Partnership at Coinstore (Global CEX). Can you please inform me who to contact regarding a potential listing?


type: message
date: 2023-02-27 06:54:24
content:
  hmm... odd question that just dawned to me... so the system has KFC and NCR... with KFC being the testing currency. Just out of curiosity, was KFC written in such a way as to mirror NCR internally? I only ask since if it was to be a full replica... doesn't that mean Neos has TWO currencies, even if KFC is just an internal token?


type: message
date: 2023-02-27 07:00:57
content:
  To my knowledge KFC is implemented pretty much the same as NCR internally such that transactions and currency related action/logix can be tested with either and they are basically the same at least user facing


type: message
date: 2023-02-27 07:03:59
content:
  All of the interactions within the game that use NCR can also be done or tested with KFC, eg tipjar or SendCredits both require input of what type of token/currency you want to use.


type: message
date: 2023-02-27 07:06:10
content:
  Makes sense. With all the usual invites that come in and just ask about listings and all that, I never bothered to consider how KFC's structure worked, since I think that gets a bit more traffic than NCR if I were to fathom a wager


type: message
date: 2023-02-27 07:31:08
content:
  CDFT doesn't 'support transactions' so it must be added or removed via backend/cloud stuff, ie you can't send your amount to someone else


type: message
date: 2023-02-27 19:26:28
content:
  That's not a token and is treated differently, it does have some of the token related features though


type: message
date: 2023-02-27 19:48:11
edit_date: 2023-02-27 19:48:22
content:
  yeah i know its just because they said currency's in game not exclusively crypto or token just more of a jab at sugarcube still existing unless your replying to the cdft thing then sorry


type: message
date: 2023-02-27 23:50:05
content:
  half are half not i guess who knows the original intention aside the fact they have a batch id so in theory its linked


type: message
date: 2023-03-04 16:57:40
content:
  The Road Map is not well-structured. It contains lists of long-term goals, upcoming updates, suspended items, further planning and various things in progress.


type: message
date: 2023-03-04 22:04:47
content:
  To make it even more garbage, I took a look at the "Partners" which they hated so much (It was the lowest part on the score), and all they did was snapshot a copy of the website at about 720p, which is why OBB is nextlined.

  Plus the constant swap in perspectives feels like it was written by someone who hardly knows how to write proper articles.

  HOWEVER... I'm more curious about the "Student Wallet," since there is no mention of that term at all on the site or whitepaper... and if it did indeed come from "the creators..."


type: message
date: 2023-03-04 22:05:59
content:
  But I do find it funny they only NOW have written an article... when it's been a solid year since the platform has received no updates. Like, welcome to club, buddy, but you're beyond late.


type: message
date: 2023-03-04 22:26:56
content:
  tested xinput through websocket which works quite well, but neos likes to take xinput gamepad as its own inputs too


type: message
date: 2023-03-04 22:27:16
content:
  I thought it was backed by Unity's input handler... but alas, it isn't... which is kind of a good thing, since Unity considers everything an acceptable joystick... like my 3D Space Navitgator, which is always a blast when I have something leaning on it.


type: message
date: 2023-03-04 22:28:59
content:
  Oh yeah. That was a fun thing to debug on VRChat: "WHY AM I CONSTNATLY SPINNING?!"
  Turns out that by default, it sets the X/Y to 0, which Unity reads as 'LEFT/UP' in raw value form. This was something I learned when writing a control scheme for the Steel Battalion Controller for Kerbal Space Program.


type: message
date: 2023-03-04 22:29:37
content:
  For now, I'm not interested in controlling Neos persay, but rather another device, with feedback visible and adjustable within Neos itself


type: message
date: 2023-03-04 22:30:54
content:
  So, for example, being able to relay inputs to my SteamDeck from directly in Neos, or taking regular joystick data from an emulator and sending it back to Neos for visual response. Hoping to get the latter done first, as that'd help pave the way towards the other direction with the SteamDeck


type: message
date: 2023-03-06 02:28:16
content:
  my confusion is why no one else in this chat noticed the video players were working... but then again, I guess that shows how the majority don't even jump in...


type: message
date: 2023-03-06 17:30:04
content:
  I think only the steam build got the update, as the separate build is still at 2022.1.28.1310_MMC21_2


type: message
date: 2023-03-06 20:59:12
content:
  Yeah, really psyched. I like the one change since it's solution is far better of a solution than what I could fathom


type: message
date: 2023-03-07 03:33:50
content:
  Once again MMC is nothing to do with the Neos team, so its timeline, judging, voting etc have no consequence on the state of Neos. 

  We changed a 2 to a 3 in our config and updated a dependency that's it.


type: message
date: 2023-03-08 10:19:24
content:
  The steam build has to be submitted to Valve. I'm not sure what is required to update the website build.


type: message
date: 2023-03-08 11:34:14
content:
  Yeah I was in the process of accumulating when the price tanked. Thought it was dead, so forgot about it


type: message
date: 2023-03-08 13:34:33
edit_date: 2023-03-08 16:21:38
content:
  Neos team is aware, presumably there is an issue doing so at the moment https://discord.com/channels/402159838827905024/439422161657135106/1082211389688520714


type: message
date: 2023-03-08 13:35:04
content:
  if its that much of a worry, it is not hard to perform the update yourself
  just the standalone has some hurdles like above


type: message
date: 2023-03-08 13:39:09
edit_date: 2023-03-08 13:45:05
content:
  You can manually update your world filter facet and update ytdlp yourself. NCR isn't affected at all.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 00:27:43
content:
  Today I tried EngageVR .io

  It looks like an alfa, very MVP UI and limited customization, but then they have companies like BMW, 3M, Stanford University, and more aboard.

  Neos is light years ahead. What do you think companies are far from Neos? Is it the adult content? Is it the founders? Is it the furry community? Is it the lack of marketing efforts?


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 00:29:17
edit_date: 2023-03-10 00:29:28
content:
  Neos is such a powerful product compared to other platforms. Neos is the metaverse, at least in the VR interaction.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 00:31:02
content:
  Maybe we just need updates and a strong administration 🤷‍♂️ , a marketing strategy in place, VC investors, a new UI.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 00:32:45
content:
  IMO, a lot of these other 'metaverse'-like platforms tend to seek that business side before bothering with the foundation. Neos on the other hand has the foundation, but not those marketing or business relationships yet. Besides the current partnership problem, I do think neos needs more user-friendly features and optimization before trying to promote itself.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 00:34:51
edit_date: 2023-03-10 00:53:39
content:
  My thought was it was the features of the platform that brought the communities over to Neos. So my thoughts on it would likely be that depending on the goals of the platform, there would need to be specific priorities to be worked on first. For example, engagevr seems to be focussing on business, so business related featues would be the priority, where comfort features such as good UI and customisation aren't as high of a priority.

  Neos was actually focussing on classroom and business related things for a short while, which is why Neos Classroom and Neos Pro exist, and was being touted to schools, but the focus shifted to community and social growth, so those priorities shifted.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 00:41:50
content:
  Just my 5 cents on the matter: There are both a perk and disadvantages to limited-scope systems like Engage. While it functions very well for communication and demonstration, that's it. Neos and other platforms with in-depth customization functions have more functions to explain and deal with, and thus have a larger scope and set of functional capabilities, but for simplicity, it also absolutely fails.

  In a sense, we do see that currently with... VRChat. While its functions are limited by comparison, it's ease of use is a major attractor and often a major argument why people prefer it over Neos (besides other reasons). Logically, you'd think people would want more functions and more capabilities, but in reality, this is sadly not the case.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 00:43:59
edit_date: 2023-03-10 00:57:57
content:
  Another example is Linux vs Windows vs Apple: Some people find Apple's simplicity to be worth it to purchase their overpriced hardware, with Windows as a common middle ground. Linux has the large list of benefits, but ease of use isn't always one of them. While Android and SteamOS both are Linux based, it required putting a paperbag on its head to make it attractable.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 00:55:35
content:
  But as a company Neos needs money to run. How is Neos doing money now? Patreon is not enough the platform will not be sustainable in the long run, depending on Patreon’s alone.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 00:58:30
content:
  Yeah, I think the same ease of use is key. You can see platforms like spatial and engage that can be used even in a mobile phone.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 01:00:43
edit_date: 2023-03-10 01:22:24
content:
  I wonder what Karel and Frooxious are doing in their everyday lives 🤷‍♂️ Working on gigs? Do they need any counseling or support?


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 01:00:59
edit_date: 2023-03-10 01:01:14
content:
  Karel  is not saying anything about this productive and constructive communication. what the hell he is doing?


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 01:08:07
content:
  When people realize how dogshit VRChat is with its dumb chinese spyware, they will make the switch and community will grow even more


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 01:09:55
content:
  The devs for VRC are incompetent. they don't even have a proper messaging system, and the one thing that you can do, invite people, doesn't even work over IPV6 because the devs are unbelievably careless


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 01:27:36
content:
  Can confirm. I've seen them in the wild, and they are always looking around and interested with creations.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 01:33:15
content:
  Uh... about that...
  This already happenned... when EAC was introduced. The problem is that people did come... but then left. While many did say it was insane what you 'can' do in Neos, it also brings up a big point, and (hot take) it's a reason why I hate Open Source being used as a primary feature:

  Sure, you CAN do anything, but how many people honestly even care? It's like when FOSS software is promoted as "You can fix and add features that don't exist," except that not everyone is a software engineer and/or has the time to deal with it.

  VRChat is an amusement park where you bring in the rides from the outside. Work is published, but when you use the client, you ride the rides.
  Neos is a system you can use to make the rides, write the apps, do the work, or just ride the rides, use the apps, or observe the work, all in addition to just hanging out.

  More advanced does not mean better. Watching the discussion about why Microsoft Word switched to the Ribbon UI was because people found menus daunting is pretty helpful in understanding the issue.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 01:37:54
edit_date: 2023-03-10 06:58:54
content:
  Say VRShiet all you want, but it is the platform that gets the money, the users, the creators, and the advertisement benefits.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 02:10:03
content:
  It is what it is and it's not going to go any further. It will only ever get more restrictive and streamlined into a content deluge.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 02:19:28
content:
  VRChat has always been following a tragectory that transitions the read/write creative culture of its early adopters into a basis for selling brand presence. For that reason it was always going to be conservative and ultimately regressive in terms of user focus and empowerment. They want that App Store money, and you don't get App Store money by keeping around Hypercard. :P


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 04:13:37
content:
  Karel used to make VR headsets? I know a guy who just paid off $86 million in debt from his previous startup in three years, and recently built a new ar company that hired 1,000 people to make ar software and hardware. Many of his former employees are at pico vr . You could work together.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 04:22:54
content:
  also, I looked it up: it wasn't an HMD, but rather an upgrade to the Oculus DK1, dubbed RiftUp. There was an attempt with an HMD after the campaign, called Claire 12M, but I'm having trouble finding nothing more than prototype photos from GDC 2015.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 06:59:58
edit_date: 2023-03-10 07:08:11
content:
  Hello everyone☺️, since I can see the lively discussion that once again mentions myself and Karel, let me respond with the usual “we are working hard” chorus.😁

  Apologies that this is going to be quite a bit long. Firstly, I think it’s important to be realistic here. 

  Neos is for sure one of the most advanced platforms, especially when it comes to interactivity and building options. Even people who have very little experience with VR are usually blown away when they see how advanced Neos is -  not just the engine and post-processing but all the asset import system, logix, multi-instancing etc. It doesn’t take a lot to realise that this is much closer to an actual scalable metaverse than any other platform. 

  But it’s not all just honey - the user experience has been quite harsh for many people who are not so well versed with VR, we have much higher system requirements than many other platforms and learning curve is far from easy. These are significant barriers to entry for many potential users. 

  Sure, you could argue that for instance, learning curve is not such a big problem because powerful software usually requires more or less learning. 
  Like you would not expect to open Blender or Adobe and just “know” what to do. 
  And this is where, just in my opinion, lies the part of the problem - Neos is many things to many people.
  So it naturally stirs incredible amount of passion about what the direction should be and how it should look like.

  Businesses are hungry for more security and privacy features, educators want more collaboration features, creators want better light rendering, others just want it to be a bad a** version of VR chat, and I think pretty much everyone would love better UI😁. 
  And of course there are NCR holders, all of you who saw potential in the project and are more focused on the financial success of the project. 

  It’s very difficult to keep everyone happy - unless - Neos is made open source, so then the development can naturaly continue in all possible directions, which would be really exciting.
  If that happened, we would be able to see more collaboration between developers and the community, new talents, leading to more features and improvements, accesibility and this would be a great news for NCR, of course, because it is likely that more companies would take notice and become interested in partnering with Neos. 
  However it is important to stress that I do not advocate that open sourcing is a silver bullet solution to all our problems. It has, for sure, its own issues like IP, security, maintaining direction etc. etc. And right now it’s just not even an option.

  But even without open sourcing, simply having more accesible, user friendly Neos will lead to more opportunities, it will be much easier to market (yes absolutely 100% thumbs up to a good marketing strategy) and overall may lead to more opportunities to expand.
  For creators, this also means a greater chance to monetize their creations and potentially earn income from their awesome work. (Again, yaay to Neos marketplace). Just imagine how empowering this will be for people who may not have so many avenues of income. Or users who live in more disadvantaged parts of the world. 

  I believe all of this will happen eventually, and we do indeed work while this bickering carries on, just as people continue to enjoy playing Neos and simply are “doing stuff”. The success of events like MMC is a wonderful proof of passion of Neos community, and personally I am grateful for their continued support regardless of any disagreements. Just watch some of the streams or visit a few worlds. I think it’s truly wonderful ☺️  https://www.twitch.tv/videos/1754154365


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 07:06:18
edit_date: 2023-03-10 07:09:23
content:
  Really excited to see what the team over at discord comes up with as well! Hopefully something worth while.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 07:10:11
content:
  I was about to say... I wholeheartedly disagree that Neos being open source will resolve anything, from previous experiences....


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 07:11:07
edit_date: 2023-03-10 07:11:24
content:
  Yeah reading over what was mentioned above was just a massive jump scare of how to quickly ruin a vr platform.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 07:11:35
content:
  Especially with having so many conversations across all current vr platforms in mass general having spoken with so many different dev teams.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 07:12:00
content:
  Thank you for your message. I love Neos, I do think Neos is the best metaverse so far, and that it will open mew opportunities for everyone.

  For sure a more accesible and friendly Neos, and a market will represent a great leap into a better future. I hope you guys are working hard.

  I’m a web and UI designer, if you need any help just let me know, I’ll help, no charge.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 07:15:00
content:
  Yes, I do agree with you, open sourcing right now would be quite mad, even if it was possible. However I do think it is important to keep opening the debate, share different perspectives, etc etc. It's why this channel exist even though sometimes it's hard to believe that when reading through the history 😅


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 07:19:09
edit_date: 2023-03-10 08:03:52
content:
  Thank you so much for this kind response, I am really glad you love Neos and your offer is very kind and I would love to hear from you, just DM me as there are never enough talented people to connect with ☺️🙏✨


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 07:21:16
edit_date: 2023-03-10 07:21:44
content:
  If that's the case then I'd quicker drop the idea of an eth based coin system before bringing up the idea of open sourcing a platform. But that's just with my experience in vr use case technology and the political environment therein. Feels like there's a disjointed message being sent. Really makes me wonder the true direction for this particular highly advanced, beautifully crafted potential of a platform.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 07:32:52
content:
  I've personally given up talking to friends about the platform with its current situation. It's led to awkward talks about why I'm still around or even continuing to build things on the platform, when logically speaking, with how long things have gone on, it's just a massive case of deja vu. Even a friend who was migrating from AltSpace who was looking for an alternative described their situation as "don't wanna go from one dying platform to another." That's left a rather heavy impact, especially with how recent it was made


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 07:41:05
content:
  The RiftUp! project was run be me as I was studying optics at the university at the time and making my own VR headsets before the Oculus Kickstarter as basically school projects. When I received the Oculus DK1 I was happy that everyone can buy a VR headset now but the resolution was so much lower than my prototypes.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 07:43:36
content:
  I’ve made an upgrade kit prototype using a much higher resolution screen and optimizing its position in the headset and needed help designing a custom board that would feed the display. Daniel is the best, can basically make any display work or even reverse ingeneer by listening to the lines on an ocsilloscope.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 07:44:11
content:
  its weird to think neos is on its "last legs"
  hopefully not for long, but you can't shake the feeling when the session browser is practically empty


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 07:46:04
content:
  Well while it is frustrating and I understand, I think everybody is free to make their own conclusions and certainly prioritize their needs. If your friends feel that Neos is no longer giving them the joy and satisfaction, it's okay to explore other platforms.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 07:46:15
content:
  Most customers for the kit were theme parks and businesses so when I produced the Claire 12M with one FullHD display and aspheric lens and Claire 24M with two FullHD displays and frenel lens it was sold mostly to them as well.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 07:47:04
content:
  In the process I met Froox and we started conceptulazing Neos as the software around back than was really basic.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 07:49:34
content:
  As my investor in the hardware manufacturing wanted to take the company a different path (two even higher res displays with frenels) than me (multi component optics like Lynx with one display) I’ve sold my shate to found Neos.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 07:51:44
edit_date: 2023-03-10 16:25:59
content:
  In terms of open-sourcng that was our agreement from the get go that we would open source Neos and one of the reasons why getting additional investors after seed was so hard.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 07:52:52
content:
  Basically all projects that have coins are open source. That is not contradictory but very much expected.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 07:54:02
edit_date: 2023-03-10 10:48:46
content:
  Being stuck in a situation proclaiming to open source but but not actually doing it for years makes it very hard to fund.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 07:55:20
content:
  Additionaly investors hated the UX as you demo as part of the pitch and it’s not exactly easy for a new user.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 07:58:28
content:
  So if we are not doing a good job with institutional investors and making the experience good for them we have to do a good job with our coin.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 08:00:01
edit_date: 2023-03-10 08:01:03
content:
  Right now our monthly cloud costs alone are much more than what the monthy income is. Not very sustainable and this needs to change.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 08:02:53
edit_date: 2023-03-10 10:49:31
content:
  Finally implementing the new UX designed by professionals and open sourcing as previouśy agreed would be a great start.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 08:06:28
content:
  Someone asked about the build linked on the website. The file is hosted on our Azure cloud, Frooxius still has access to it so whether he choses to update that one or not is his choice.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 08:06:43
content:
  Makes alot of sense! And of course why repeat the flaws of the past when we can better the future of new systems in vr? So again this is alot of various interesting language to push for a better insensitive but hopefully, the proper actualized methodology will be worthwhile while all of this here that you speak on gets figured out. 🙂


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 08:08:39
edit_date: 2023-03-10 08:08:48
content:
  Probably bandwidth has I would assume neos overall framework is no more than 8tb if I had to guesstimate


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 08:11:56
edit_date: 2023-03-10 08:12:50
content:
  There is over 9TB of blob storage and and 40GB database. The costs are anywhere between 11 000 to 25 000 Eur per month depending on how busy it is.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 08:14:14
content:
  It would be incredibly nice. Hopefully finding the right direction to help alleviate some of those costs could force the alienated problems to get resolved for amazing future developments!


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 08:16:15
content:
  On a side note I'm still very excited to see the future direction of neos as I've still got massive growing community focused on vr fitness and vr biking. So really excited for the future of neos and the apps I'm working on.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 08:17:01
content:
  I’m glad to read you Karel. Is cool to know about your background on VR hardware.

  I’m also impressed on how expensive is to keep Neos running. I wonder how you guys get the money to pay for the servers 😅

  Have you looked for investment in Silicon Valley? Asia and the US investors are investing like crazy in metaverse companies.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 08:19:02
edit_date: 2023-03-10 08:19:37
content:
  We had hundreds of talks with investors but all of them said no due to our UX and intent to open source. Once you say that it’s over 😄


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 08:29:28
content:
  He is hell-bent on the company saying that all of Neos code is his personal ownerhip which the company obviously cannot do as it’s against its interest.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 08:34:09
content:
  The last time we spoke about it I got pitched a crazy idea to create our own rendering engine instead of relying on Unity for that. Which is a great idea in general but not at the expanse of not solving the huge amount of existing problems.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 08:35:41
edit_date: 2023-03-10 08:52:14
content:
  I think the reason is that being an architectural astronaut as Carmack calls it is very fun but actually perfecting and optimizing something is what is needed.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 08:43:15
edit_date: 2023-03-10 08:44:32
content:
  Pretty crazy business wise as we have plenty more pressing problems. From an architectural point of view very desirable in the long term but also very expensive to maintain. Graphic drivers are probably one of the biggest shitshows there are with not even their devs knowing too well how it works 😄


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 08:49:31
content:
  One of neos's biggest problems right now is unity i'd say, because well, it's quite limiting. that's my opinion because i've worked with a lot of transparent materials


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 08:50:53
content:
  Transparency is always a nightmare in any engine.... but generally speaking, Unity is very... weird by default with it.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 08:51:44
content:
  The other issue is that you become bound by its limits. That's why HiFi wrote a fully custom... everything. When trackers came out, they were easy to add because the engine was fully laid out and expandable.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 08:56:18
content:
  There are for sure advanatages of doing everything ourselves but creating and mostly maintaining an engine like that is a huge expensive undertaking. Not mentioning all the comforts of Unity lost like SDKs.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 08:58:44
content:
  Yeah lets do it when the easy stuff like UX and funding is solved. Why bet the company now when we can do that later.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 09:01:38
content:
  But neos is it's own engine, I feel like if a unity Neos thing was made, then that would be too dependent on Unity. Currently, Neos's link to unity is very malleable, due to Neos not being dependant on it.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 09:03:29
edit_date: 2023-03-10 09:03:55
content:
  And it already is written in a way for the Unity part to be replaceable, due to implementable components. It's a neat system that somehow makes the framework pluggable


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 09:07:20
content:
  It works ina looser way but imagine for example a headless telling unreal what to render, its fundamentally the same


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 09:07:35
edit_date: 2023-03-10 09:07:48
content:
  Even if technically possible, the Unreal license doesn't allow anything that recreates features from the development kit to run in runtime AFAIK, I can be wrong on that


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 09:11:08
content:
  I'm... more confused how you could take an engine composed in C# and have it work with a C++ based system... even if just for the rendering pipeline... That's a wrapper I wouldn't want to even fathom


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 09:12:40
content:
  It is possible. I was even thinking of writing rendering engine in Rust and using a .NET runtime for all the logic


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 09:23:10
edit_date: 2023-03-10 09:23:58
content:
  The point is sure lets do rendering keep both builds see how feasable it is but in a situation when cloud doesnt hang by a thread.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 09:26:00
content:
  That's actually one bottleneck I recently saw. Somehow the networking code manages to take up a lot of frame time. For a reason I haven't found out yet


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 09:30:45
content:
  but most lag is from when content is hosted locally... and usually when receiving a large amount of init chunk data...


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 09:32:17
content:
  How would it look crappy?

  Also, unrelated but there's one thing i also need to ask you karel. Why are you still trying to cling onto Neos?

  What do you gain from this? This is a genuine question. What do you want for Neos?


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 09:33:01
edit_date: 2023-03-10 09:33:18
content:
  You guys we don’t solve existing problems at Neos we just start new projects creating more problems instead, you have it all backwards 😄


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 09:35:45
edit_date: 2023-03-10 10:38:44
content:
  Rendering is doing progressively smarter math to paint pixels. Both for realtime and raytracing. You need a ot of smart people to make it look nice and keep up with new hw and drivers.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 09:37:08
edit_date: 2023-03-10 09:37:19
content:
  Well I founded the company and run it. The company provides the cloud and Neos build on Steam. I kinda have to continue for Neos to work. 😄


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 09:43:19
content:
  While I admire Frooxes technical skills very much he has no understanding of financials or how companies work. I was unable to explain even basic stuff like the difference between a legal and physical entity, run rates. It’s not that hes not smart enough, on the contrary. It’s so boring to him that his brain just goes brrrrrrr to something more interesting.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 09:44:31
edit_date: 2023-03-10 09:44:51
content:
  We need someone with business experience and good track record. A business degree like I have would be nice as well.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 09:47:25
content:
  Yeah thats called a puppet CEO that never goes well. The person has to be able and willing to run a business.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 09:54:01
content:
  Honestly i still feel like you're trying to find ways to stay CEO, when the Neos team + froox wants to go their own way, It's not worth it, and they will not budge. it honestly feels like you're holding us hostage, the core community that actually plays the game almost daily. How can you say it won't go well when it's not going well right now?


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 09:55:35
content:
  I think actually the CTO is holding you hostage. My role as CEO is making sure cloud is paid which it is. CTO is supposed to do updates which he doesnt.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 09:57:38
content:
  If he wants a different CEO he is supposed to propose one. I like the idea and our investors would cersinly like it as well and would vote for it on a board meeting.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 10:10:26
edit_date: 2023-03-10 10:10:56
content:
  Not really, Frooxius asked me to do something I legally can’t (say code is his personal ownerhip, imagine how this looks from the point of our investors and their rights) and then declined to talk about anything else/constructive


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 10:12:25
content:
  Yes I’m the only one with access to our bank accounts and private keys. If I have access to Nex or Geenz we’d be bankrupt in about two weeks.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 10:15:39
edit_date: 2023-03-10 10:23:31
content:
  Jesus first of the buy backs were caused by Froox tantrum. Second it would be a rug pull if we take ICO money and then not help holders when price collapses. Third its not easy for the company to move crypto to governmnet money you get KYCd, AMMAd and taxed to hell.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 10:21:53
content:
  I do know someone who'd be find the position of CEO to be enticing, but they'd prefer to discuss the numbers more specifically before accepting such a role. They find the server cost situation concerning, especially if it has surpassed the general income. I'm guessing just have them email hello@neos.com?


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 10:25:28
edit_date: 2023-03-10 10:26:09
content:
  However, Frooxius had to put things right after your mistakes. Call it a tantrum... I call it damage control


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 10:29:10
edit_date: 2023-03-10 10:29:32
content:
  Well looking at the price is not everything, a lot of people sold NCR for much better prices than they would otherwise without an buyback. Looking out for your investors and coin holders is a huge part of running a business which too little people seem to understand.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 10:30:37
content:
  Buy backs, even though a thing to control damage, are not a way to save NCR. Staking also isn't a thing to help NCR. Utility would, but that'd require some work no one seems to be willing to do currently


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 10:30:45
edit_date: 2023-03-13 14:40:22
content:
  Believe me I tried hiring people for Ethereum, noone wants it. Everyone wants government money instead. Its not that simple.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 10:32:09
content:
  True but its fairly simple for a person to convert crypto to fiat. Not for a company. Still almost noone seems to be willing to do it.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 10:32:13
content:
  The one thing I know off hand right now is, that accidental signature on the newest whitepaper that wasn't supposed to be there


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 10:44:41
content:
  Theres lot of kinds of analytics, the grouping doesn't make all that much sense it depends on the service we use multiple.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 10:49:12
content:
  from azure "Azure provides a range of services and tools to help you manage and govern your resources, including monitoring and alerts, access and identity management, policy enforcement, and cost optimization. These services are designed to help you manage and secure your resources effectively, and ensure compliance with regulatory requirements.

  The "management and governance" fee covers the cost of providing these services and tools to you, and may vary depending on the number and type of resources you have deployed in Azure. You can find more information about your invoice and the specific charges associated with your Azure usage in your Azure portal or through your Azure billing account.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 10:52:43
edit_date: 2023-03-10 10:52:54
content:
  now that's a bit of a stretch it depends on azure and speculating as the CEO is definitely not a good look. try to stay professional probably contact azure and ask for a Itemised bill for all the areas for governance since your name is on the bill


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 10:53:12
content:
  Jesus again the ssl certificate problem was because our host declined service because of repeated ddos attacks


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 10:53:12
content:
  Not implying anything, I'm just wondering what the services are that go into that position and why they are necessary


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 10:53:56
content:
  We had an Azure expert take a look and he said thats normal but the app (Neos) seems very poorly optimized


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 10:56:34
content:
  as ive said contact azure since your name is on the bill and ask for a itemised bill for all areas on what they explicitly are spending it on.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 10:59:35
edit_date: 2023-03-10 10:59:42
content:
  He also said our database is seriously shot a lot of out of spec records that will be a nightmare sooner or later


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 11:02:38
content:
  Froox has always made it very clear that switching areas of work is hard for him and damages flow, so not really


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 11:04:36
content:
  Froox would never miss such fun, also being dependent on Geenz doesnt sound like a great place for a business


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 11:05:39
edit_date: 2023-03-10 11:06:03
content:
  Being dependent on a single person, who knows the internals of a critical part of a project, is never a good idea. If they are the only one knowing this


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 11:08:00
edit_date: 2023-03-10 11:08:54
content:
  Later I proposed him a salary increase and even to buy a house for him with a morgage he could afford thanks to the higher salary


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 11:08:39
edit_date: 2023-03-10 11:09:06
content:
  And the high salary is normal for US, as they have to pay all those taxes and insurances themselves from what they earn. That is very different from EU citizens, where most of these are already deducted from their salaries


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 11:09:44
content:
  Being dependent on state pension is a risky thing as our national system is in dire condition. I explained that having a property would help him in the future. Of course no takers.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 11:10:52
edit_date: 2023-03-10 11:11:14
content:
  Yes Geenz wanted salary of a Seattle startup. We are not a Seattle startup cant afford it for the reasons I explained above. Seattle startups cater to their investors we dont.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 11:11:17
content:
  I'd probably have declined that offer as well. Having a morgage also means, I rely on having a secure job and I might be bound


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 11:12:36
content:
  Btw you can always sell a house even if there is mortgage. The buyer just overtakes it or gets it refinanced.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 11:14:39
content:
  Not sure I can post the contract here probs not because of GDPR. You would have to have his allowance for that.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 11:20:01
content:
  Your right, people who do work together do build friendships in some way, but it's normally a professional friendship, but you'd still go for a beer sometimes


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 11:22:51
edit_date: 2023-03-10 11:23:25
content:
  One reason companies don't like families getting involved or getting positions in the same place/dept


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 11:31:03
content:
  ...then use Tilia? No one seems to have an issue with them, and their primary related platform is basically the granddad of all controversial online stuff back in the day.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 11:42:57
content:
  I think that I would wait forever as there is no incentive for s capable CEO right now to take on Neos. We first need to get our act together.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 11:44:49
content:
  Yes and that seems like a contradiction if you want a new CEO you shouldnt make it less enticing for him or her to join


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 11:46:06
content:
  I want out but only if Neos is in good hands. I own a lot to everyone involved to go out lights shut.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 11:46:33
content:
  So what if you had someone who is interested in helping while taking no payment from you at the moment until things start to go into the right direction?


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 11:47:22
edit_date: 2023-03-10 11:47:54
content:
  My goal personally for neos is to have it as one of the best leading industry standards of VR. Genuinely.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 11:49:06
edit_date: 2023-03-10 11:49:25
content:
  You need someone with a business mindset as well as an understanding of the current market for both major consumer as well as major business practices, correct?


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 11:50:15
content:
  This is where things get interesting because it's built on the idea of wanting something best for both the passionate as well as the ones who have significant amount of capital to help see the vision.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 11:57:40
content:
  Hmm.. this makes me think of when my fitness project on vrchat got compared to the entirety of meta for having legs when the general masses of users only thought that people were floating torsos just to find out people workout in group training sessions together. There's alot of ways to make this work out and have you still be co owner etc. Give me some time to look into options and my network and considering the weight of what goes on, my expertise specifically is in VR use case technologies and what the general public want with vr. I just build things that make vr more desirable for the general public to use and want to use more frequently. 

  So even just looking at the full project for Neos VR, I'm just thinking in terms of "how do we lead operations in a direction that makes more people want to use our platform" which I can think of several ideas of how to gauge that interest. for the userbase. While using examples of what has worked on 'similar' platforms.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 11:59:57
edit_date: 2023-03-10 12:01:44
content:
  I think Neos needs an overhaul completely to make it palatable for everyone interested in VR first. Cater to creators to have them create content, that people want to explore. Open gates for everyone to simply put on their VR headset, start Neos on steam, select and avatar and go exploring


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 12:02:11
content:
  And for the investment part, companies should be able to buy in for having their products be in virtual exhibits, that people can visit. One idea would be to have car companies have their cars replicated in VR for people to explore and maybe have some semi-realistic driving experience with them


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 12:03:05
content:
  Another popular activity I've seen in Neos would be driving cars. That might be something where NCR might come in handy, by paying licensing to companies, to have their cars being part of the racing track simulation


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 12:03:55
content:
  I'm thinking more of exhibits. Let's think of them like ad space in the world browser, just not called ads


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 12:05:07
content:
  One of the major drawbacks from my 20k hours in vr platforms I've noticed with some platforms is lack of personal user safety. As well as advertising for the community to help it grow in a way that helps bring users together. A struggle with the vr platforms that people have that I've noticed alot is trying to advertise too much "who" is here and not "why should anyone be here" and a focused direction on streamlining ease of use and options with developments are there they just need to be actualized to help people want to come to the platform and use it more frequently. 

  You want to ask the people who use the platform the most and you know have a genuine desire to make the platform grow, "Hey guys, what do you want?" Starting with your team, down to your moderators to your general community. You have to ask the questions. You need to work with the opinions of what the team wants and be willing to accept a few hits to any possible ego or knowledge of understanding something better than others around you and trying to take in what everyone wants to re structure the building process of the platform.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 12:05:28
content:
  I guess another major problem is time frame and how 'fast' things need to be actualized before investors start to want to pull the plug on the project.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 12:06:58
content:
  So far, I have seen, if you have the users, you keep users. People stay, because their friends are on the platform, not because the platform is any good


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 12:09:58
content:
  I'd even use "The Universe" as an example about what kind of exhibitions companies can put into Neos. The more fun the experiences are, the more people want to see it


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 12:10:09
content:
  Well, that's not entirely true. Because we've seen even with for example eac and VRC, people split across multiple platforms causing a massive rift in who went where and as updates happened over the years people went back to vrc. 

  Not to say that people didn't stay in places like Neos and Chillout VR, which Chill out has seen some very interesting advancements over the years but this is to speak on another topic that isn't spoken on most. the 'quiet majority' most of the people who say the least would be the ultimately most impactful because people just wanna live their lives and just hope that their space is safe and what they want from and of it. Community retention is gained through letting your community speak so freely of any situation.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 12:11:18
content:
  But that can only go so far and you can only do so much, you have to entice the major investors who are usually also part of that quiet majority and sometimes without question can just pull a major part of your funding because 'they just felt like it'


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 12:15:46
content:
  And I think, open-source could also be sold to investors, given, they want to actually use the VR space for themselves


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 12:16:42
content:
  Neos isn't just a socializing platform. And besides Classroom. It can definitely help in many other spaces, where 3D models of things help in developing


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 12:17:00
content:
  At that rate you might as well just make neos it's own coding platform like unity or unreal. But High Fidelity tried open source and we now never hear about it.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 12:18:01
content:
  As you can see with the company, they completely settled down to real world conferencing hardware for VoIP devices


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 12:19:27
content:
  And Neos can certainly provide a good conferencing solution as well. Even with the ability to be your real self as avatar with the new 3D scanning technologies, that exist already


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 12:21:14
content:
  Why wouldn't you want your vr platform to focus on socializing? We've established the building and teaching aspects and functionality of teaching within the scope of possibility is of course a thing. But if that's all it's for then that's not what the major aspects of the world really just want. If you want a vr super platform you have to encompass all of the aspects of what people want from gaming, creating, coding, working, etc. And as of right now, the general masses want socialization and games and a strong sense of community and personal safety while interacting with others.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 12:26:46
content:
  Think about how Sony's mocapi project that worked with vrchat vs meta. Meta has tremendous funding budget of 26 billion. And didn't release the idea of having legs in a platform until October 2022? Companies need to see potential and uses before they'll want to support and sponsor something and investors need to see that the platform is going in a healthy enough direction to actually turn a profit for the future.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 12:28:29
content:
  Across thousands of hours of research into vr and platform use cases. It's just missing some critical features that will make people want to use the platform, including businesses to open up to the idea of actually making sales through the platform itself.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 12:31:03
content:
  Just more things to put on the docket of studying for my own research since again, all I want for Neos is for it to succeed because if it does better, everything else in the vr world has to be better as well and for me being the enthusiast and now a business owner that operates solely through vr, I want vr to go further, much faster than it's going right now because I know with the right money in the right hands it can exactly do that.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 13:10:45
content:
  I also think the historic baggage is stopping neos a bit, but really its just ownership of the code. There is no easy solution beside absolut ownership of one side OR giving both sides a copy and calling it even. The world where there is a new CEO and it suddenly works? I don't see that happening. Froox probably doesn't want to invest his time into something he doesn't really own, its his child, he doesn't want to be payed for it, he wants to have control of it.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 13:11:59
content:
  Sure this is a business, but thats the perspective from the outside. I am a developer, i have a project (a game) i worked for 15 years on, and i know that there is no price on that amount of personal investment


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 13:12:38
content:
  That is not a good idea though, it might really be better to keep the company together and replace the CEO


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 13:13:38
content:
  Hey, surprise me ;) Sure i mean there is a lot of bad blood, like really bad blood that prevents any of the sides trusting each other. Replacing the CEO? Sure could help, but in my mind it will probably not solve the underlying problem.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 13:15:11
content:
  The name neos means nothing, its the system that is revolutionary, all that timeinvestment that lead to this unique system. If its called neos or trilly or blablub (i am making that up, don't search it)


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 13:18:27
content:
  Yea well, i also don't want to lose all the years i did things in neos. Making friends, making my first avatars, codes, interfaces... whole games out of items (i would never have thought it possible, but the way to program in neos is unlike anything i even expected or learned before)


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 13:19:55
content:
  The community will move, the hardware is replaceable, hey its 99% in a cloud... it even runs offline and you can create your own neos with some slight changes to configurations


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 16:45:28
edit_date: 2023-03-10 16:48:37
content:
  Moving to Godot rendering is the best option with libgodotsharp it makes it much easier to connect only the parts needed without needing to run the whole Godot engine in the background


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 16:51:11
content:
  Godot is a open source game engine like unity but some people just want rendering or other parts of it that's what libgodotsharp is for since Godot is open source you can use pieces in it


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 16:55:59
content:
  true, if that process is automatic the transition to a new rendering engine would be smooth, because no one wants to go in every material of everything and convert manually


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 19:19:32
content:
  *adds a "Alex do you remember that we have an engineering team and that they exist and do stuff" logix node*


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 19:22:53
edit_date: 2023-03-10 19:22:58
content:
  Ooo that's a good rendering Engine, it can render cheese in Ultra 128K with HDR++++ and it supports Dolby Ultra Max Extreme XR 128Dimensions audio


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 19:23:33
content:
  CheeseRenderingEngine is also always up to date, you never have to update it. Because it's just literally a block of cheese and as we know cheese matures with age.


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 19:24:14
content:
  Well it's gonna take really long then to switch to a new rendering engine unless there is a hidden Neos with full rendering engine made by Geenz in a year hidden but i doubt


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 19:26:00
content:
  And then it doesn't matter anymore at a certain point because then even if you magically released a Neos 2.0 people will then always remember it as no updates and not even try anymore


type: message
date: 2023-03-10 19:29:38
content:
  It's gonna be Godot or 3 years of trying all other rendering engines and then becoming Godot after 3 years


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 03:41:23
content:
  The furry community did nothing except continue to use the platform you banked on. If anything, they, and every one else on the platform, furry, anime, robot, human, whoever, cared more for the soul of the project.


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 03:42:06
content:
  Afterall, on the website itself, the platform was designed for everyone. I find it funny that is still a constant rebuttle with VERY LITTLE evidence of people investing into NCR trying to actually help the platform.


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 03:43:16
content:
  and those who DID, ended up loving the platform for what it is: a powerful system that could encompass almost everything people wanted in a virtual world, be it in Desktop, VR, or even mobile


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 03:45:46
content:
  Neos became a place where I recall seeing people who brought their NFT models in and made them functional, given a purpose other than just a three dimensional art piece with a receipt attached. Those people then learned how to use various tools and understand complex concepts, all backed by their experiences from trying Neos


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 03:46:34
content:
  They began to make their own assets, their own art, to compliment what they uploaded. You can have a negative opinion on NFTs, but still give credit to the effort they were putting into respecting the system


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 03:47:02
content:
  same goes with NCR: People purchased it, then looked around, and became more than just fans, but their own power users


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 03:52:48
content:
  That's very strange. Whenever the platform is ever brought up, it's always "the furries" this and "the furries" that. Never the people actually on the platform... even if the majority fit the bill...


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 03:57:42
content:
  There's been no evidence of that. Again, the only people who seem to believe it reside in this echo chamber.


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 03:57:49
content:
  This has time and time again been proven to be an unsubstantiated rumor with no Merit.

  If you have evidence of it submit a ticket to moderation.neos.com


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 03:59:02
content:
  Again... there's no evidence... and last I checked... no one was fired... There are no announcements regarding such a critical change...


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 04:01:42
edit_date: 2023-03-11 04:02:01
content:
  Alternative theory, the people who don't like other people are making up rumors to undermine their stance.


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 04:05:08
content:
  Ok, now that one is actually true. But we have rules and guidelines in place to separate those systems. When those rules are breached account restrictions are imposed on the users.

  We also work with businesses and educational places to further segregate those users using additional features that exist inside neos.


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 04:07:22
content:
  The various 'universes' system, which barriers users to only allow access within that universe and other users also in it?


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 04:13:13
content:
  That's incorrect, I don't have them to hand but Karel has made several remarks regarding adult content, that you can search and read. Generally/afaik he'd like some changes to better support both sides of that argument but he's not for the complete removal of such content.

  Do you just have a book of rumors that you periodically repeat on loop?

  I'd encourage you to write my answers down in your book.


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 04:14:37
content:
  Honestly, Karel wanting to enhance the regulations is a bigger step than what the more popular platforms have done... So not sure why people would be mad at him over that.


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 04:16:56
edit_date: 2023-03-12 11:35:03
content:
  I'm fighting for the truth, the dismissal of baseless rumors and to get us back on track to making a project. But thank you for assuming my intentions instead of just asking me about them.


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 04:21:00
content:
  that... collaboration argument falls apart on so many levels...

  Like, riddle me this: Say that is true. Say that the virtual dimensional representative of dairy products Prime and Geenz did want to damage the entire platform for personal interest... Uh... then what the heck are they going to do with an empty platform?
  Like, if that's what everyone is using, including themselves... why would they want to damage it? That's like the meme of sticking a rod in a tire of a bike and claiming to be a victim; it holds no water.


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 04:22:56
content:
  I think your comments are now straying into against the rules of this telegram sir, https://wiki.neosvr.com/Neos_Telegram


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 04:28:06
content:
  You are referring to the team as "immature furries" and calling them children.

  It is straying into the "not kind" region. That's all. I'm not a mod here after all. I just like to ensure you're aware of the rules.


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 04:30:54
content:
  I don't need to be told what occurred in the conversation... I was very much there as it was being written...


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 04:31:36
content:
  Ok, you didn't refer to the team in that light, but you did to our users, That's still not that kind. But I digress.


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 04:40:12
content:
  So... not sure how that's playing victim when the amount they'd be paid would effectively be cut down by about 30%, let alone gas fees, when it comes to their earnings


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 04:41:42
content:
  Considering they have to be paid in EUR, that means the crypto is being sold to pay for it. If you can do that to pay a monthly bill, you can do that to pay a person.


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 04:42:56
content:
  However, money wasn't really the factoring concern for the team members. That has been a consistent reminder every time it is brought up.


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 04:45:21
content:
  Patreon and any ETH donations, I guess. The NCR token is/was supposed to be a supportive token regarding your charity towards the system's development, which could be possibly used in the future to supplement the market once it was completed.


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 04:46:13
content:
  In otherwords, people who speculated on its value and tried to turn it into a stock ultimately destroyed its meaning, and thus also destroyed its value very quickly, since it was never intended to be handled as such


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 05:07:03
content:
  While the latter part was mentioned a few times as a suggestion, it was also suggested to look more closely at the bills themselves, since it was just a general summary of all items into their departments.


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 05:13:43
content:
  This channel has done nothing but discuss a digital currency to infinitum, ignoring what even gave it any value. Everyone cared about rising numbers, but not a strong foundation.


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 05:16:09
content:
  Even then... the people who do nothing but invest and claim business facts like it's a rare genetic trait seem to have so little knowledge about the platform... they forgot Neos is P2P... meaning content can be saved locally. Should the servers go down... the content can be backed up.


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 05:19:25
content:
  Additionally, there hasn't been a discrimination against a cryptocurrency. All that has been presented is a system failing to fulfill its duties and being heavily flawed.


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 05:20:03
content:
  the irony being... it seems the tables are the other way: the people who use cryptocurrencies the most have the highest level of discrimination.


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 05:24:38
content:
  That might be true but i think a common perspective is to be civil and refrain from picking holes in the person and instead pick holes in their argument.


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 05:30:14
content:
  That's very strange. Now i've told you about it perhaps you can try a different approach.

  To aid with this, there are many "child" investors, business leaders, entrepreneurs etc. From a basic definition point they are still children though.

  So with those examples in mind, it should be logical to conclude that one's age does not necessarily determine their worth, experience or validity of points in a debate. 

  As such age isn't really a valid reason to dismiss someone's ideas here.


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 05:32:59
content:
  Oh i navigate them all the time. Usually through a merging of cultural differences. Where a common merge point is "let's try not to offend anyone" this is ofcourse very difficult. But I don't think continually using the "child" argument after being informed that its not exactly seen as kind in this part of a world is very professional either.


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 05:33:51
content:
  By your definitions, no one is professional. Having had the luxory of meeting and speaking with most people who have operated or even founded the current set of social VR platforms (two of which I was interviewed for), there are no major differences in how things are handled for business operation, development, or investments.


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 12:48:49
content:
  I wonder what is going to happen first - agreement between CEO and CTO, or neos running out of funds, resulting in turning off the servers.


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 14:40:25
content:
  I always saw NCR as something that is not a traditional cryptocurrency in the sense that it is not intended to be used as a medium of exchange or store of value outside of the Neos VR platform.


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 14:42:01
content:
  So, there is not really an investment into NCR, that makes no sense at all. Holding NCR was "investment" into the platform that's Neos VR. Not to get money in return, but to help developing maybe the best metaverse application that is out there


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 14:43:09
content:
  So my hope was, that having NCR, I'd get some perks in the future, that'd be exclusive to NCR holders inside of Neos VR. However I see that being destroyed piece by piece the more there's discussion in various places


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 14:49:54
content:
  What you don't understand, and what was explained a few posts above, is Karel invested 10 years in building neos, which included a lot of sacrifices and stressful situations, finally leading into a success. He wants to leave but does not want it to see it turn into ruin few weeks after passing it to somebody incompetent.


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 14:56:01
edit_date: 2023-03-11 16:45:13
content:
  Even then, I see none of the team members to have the necessary attitude to do the things that have to be done for the investors


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 14:57:29
content:
  Though, I could guess, that every single individual required for that position, will be voted out by the team, because of their attitude


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 15:00:16
content:
  so the "smart " team wasted 5 years not to update the UX and open source which stop the funding from investor ?


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 15:04:32
content:
  The CEO is the executor who represents the interests of the shareholders of the company and is responsible to the shareholders


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 15:05:42
content:
  If employees cannot carry out the decisions and instructions of the management, the solution is simple, just replace the team no matter how much contribution they have made in the past


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 15:07:04
content:
  Find someone who represents the interests of the shareholders as replacement for Karel. However Karel stays as shareholder, you see the problem some might have with that?


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 15:08:23
content:
  Technology will always be outdated and requires constant iteration. The company needs to continue to create profits to maintain operations. More funds-more talents-better products and services-more revenue


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 15:11:23
content:
  @baggioblue Waz is talking about, that Karel actually wants to leave and give someone else the CEO role


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 15:12:27
content:
  However, you cannot keep a CEO who wants to leave. The shareholders would have to find a new person for that role then


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 15:15:53
content:
  No shareholder in any company will put up with a team not following through on management's orders, for whatever reason


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 15:21:29
content:
  Actually... enterprise grade applications are those beasts, where no one knows how it works and you can replace the whole development team and still be productive


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 15:21:43
content:
  Have you ever heard of a company where the team doesn't want to work under the CEO, I've never seen one


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 15:23:55
content:
  And looks like baggioblue isn't only against the team, but also against Karel and probably everything that is Neos as of today


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 15:25:29
content:
  because the team 
  Can't generate profits for the company Can't attract more talents Can't make the company a respectable company


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 15:25:38
content:
  The team has said in the past they dont want NCR holders anymore.. And the team has said they have no plans to support it. Karel was the only onw who said he intends to support it


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 15:27:30
content:
  theyve been asked this "could you hire a blockchain dev to.manage NCR and build out its features" and the answer was "we want nothing to do with it".


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 15:28:10
content:
  I don't think it is the whole team. It's only a few or maybe even a single individual wanting to pull the rug. Might even be that naive, not even realizing that those actions result in a rug pull


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 15:28:44
content:
  This came after it was pointed out they could fork NCR and take control of it. An option they apparently didnt know existed or was possible


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 15:29:54
content:
  Yeah but its my belief that the team opperates strongly from groupthink and would be quick to ostracise a crypto-positive member (of which I dont think there is one)


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 15:32:59
content:
  Either way its been pointing out in the past that if Karel left, they could still fork NCR for its user's sake. Their response was that they didnt know that was possible (which is funny because they often talked about being knowledgible on the topic) and then that they had no desire to. Theyve implied that NCR is around only because Karel is. And I havent really seen a single word from a dev implying otherwise.


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 15:35:16
content:
  However, from the buy backs, a lot of NCR are available to the company. If being smart about it, developers could implement utility in Neos. These could be sinks for NCR and that'd effect demand for NCR, which they could use to turn all the NCR from buy backs back into usable money


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 15:38:22
content:
  It could be. It needs to be thought of and discussed in earnest. I dont think there's an ability to do that. Either because the team's general feelings, philosophy, desire to appease the mob or the work/knowledge involved.


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 15:40:08
content:
  We're positive on NCR here but over on the discord they are pretty mask-off hateboner for it and thats who the devs listen to


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 15:41:18
content:
  even with ETH PoS transition, it showed it wasn't about the environment to the community, it was about emotional sentiment


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 15:41:28
content:
  I can tell you where my hate lies. It's fully on the pump and dump scheme that was done on NCR and the whole aftermath it caused


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 15:42:30
content:
  i still accept ncr for codeing stuff and 3d printing still so eh XD idk if you would calle me a supporter or postive towards it but eh


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 15:44:43
content:
  this was a industry wide move but the moves on NCR were exaggerated because NCR was very low cap and when the drama started, the team went very anti-crypto and if anyone is holding NCR and seeing thr developers for it see it with disdain or apathy, no one wants to hold onto that


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 15:45:33
content:
  And there are these wallets that made a lot of profit. And people are looking for possible owners of these wallets and want to shift the blame on people


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 15:46:53
content:
  and the infighting announcements sure hurt their holders. I would compare NCR to something like MANA if I was curious what NCR could look like if the team didnt turn on their own holders. Still bad but much better than this. And Neos is a much better product I'd add.


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 15:48:31
content:
  as they might possibly belong to Karel, or maybe even you. We won't know who owns them until they are being used


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 15:49:14
content:
  Of course we are seeking blame and those wallets are a neat thing to assign blame, but we don't know who owns these. It's all speculation


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 15:49:38
content:
  so MANA topped out at $5 at the peak of the craze. Now its at $.5 so thats to say its doing about 10x better than NCR


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 15:50:19
content:
  if NCR didnt have devs and community that were hostile to the holders, I think itd be fairing better than MANA actually


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 15:50:51
edit_date: 2023-03-11 15:51:03
content:
  as a general community member tbh talking about utility it was more based on users creating utility due to we can access it through the tipjar events component and intergrate it into stuff i did a social experiment with it where people could buy plots in a town world, though most "holders" i spoke to a year ago never touched the game. so implimenting utility seemed pointless to me as the ones with the currency didnt want to play the game.


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 15:51:03
content:
  it's a matter of utility, I think. Implement sinks for NCR into Neos VR (more than just storage) and the value might go up again


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 15:53:01
content:
  I think its more of sentiment, but then again I think in the market sentiment>utility (atleast for now, utility always catches up... usually on the downside)


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 15:53:57
content:
  I was thinking that Marketplace might be a nice way to create a sink for NCR. However that doesn't seem to work very well


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 15:54:06
content:
  how lucky of them, to have ppl funding the game? We should find weird ideologicsl reasons to attack them.


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 15:54:22
edit_date: 2023-03-11 15:55:13
content:
  im not attacking you ? personally i wanted ncr to succeed as a ingame token no idea about its future.


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 15:55:08
content:
  Im being sarcastic because thats a common excuse to attack the NCR holders thst they "dont actually play"


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 15:55:15
content:
  Like, if any transaction on the Marketplace would have to be done in NCR, with a percentage of NCR being removed as fees, that could have been another sink for NCR. As a parallel, the marketplace of second life works like that. You can buy with dollars and they are converted to L$ and a part of that is paid as a fee


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 15:55:40
content:
  most of them did not the ones i talked to or contacted some did such as the Pizza dao and i helped them set stuff up but aside that not many interactions


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 15:56:40
content:
  And I am out of ideas for sinks to NCR, which would actually be able to create financing for the dev team


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 15:57:17
edit_date: 2023-03-12 20:25:46
content:
  Used to play, now Neos is like a badfeels zone because Ive been treated so bad by the community and devs


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 15:58:08
content:
  theres tons of ideas and uses for an ingame currency... its just none of them are able to be discussed freely.


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 15:58:28
edit_date: 2023-03-11 15:58:47
content:
  NCR can be used to pay for storage in Neos VR. That's a sink, however it only frees funds to be used to pay the azure computing costs so far, if any NCR would be even used for that


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 15:59:34
content:
  If you.discuss NCR utility, the discord will attack you, the devs will shut you down for community karma, and youll get draggged into pointless argunents with people who have too much free time


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 15:59:39
content:
  NCR is not a security. By only holding NCR, you still aren't a shareholder NCR doesn't make you own parts of the company


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 16:00:13
content:
  So NCR uses can only be discussed here, which is a quarantine the devs dont look at.. and if they do, its to sneer at


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 16:01:43
edit_date: 2023-03-11 16:07:52
content:
  imo it should, lol. I personally think the whole situation is a type of fraud and NCR holders should be entitled to their dues


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 16:05:31
content:
  I did briefly but I could read the room and I wasnt helping. Devs dont give a shit about alternative perspectives. More likely youre just entertaining people who fancy an argument


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 16:08:20
edit_date: 2023-03-11 16:08:38
content:
  honestly might open a thread in there on the discussion for utility and see what happens just write up a few ideas to have a discussion since i dont rly see much arguments


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 16:15:35
content:
  well the thing is i could easily make worlds that use ncr but actually telling my external server someone did a transaction but then also try not to give users in the world builder as they might tamper with the system to break it


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 16:18:10
content:
  yeah sure its kinda weird concept in neosvr since all worlds can just be opened and make a new session thats why you need to incorporate community / utility of the coin in the world such as if i could sell u certain assets using the coin but then again duplication items its all fun to think of a idea


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 16:18:19
content:
  yeah of course, but theyre ideologically driven. They see the word "rent" and they start accusing you of being a capitalist and that VR is not about that etc etc.


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 16:18:28
content:
  like i know the downside of doing it but if you build a community and have a reason for people to join the world


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 16:19:06
content:
  then again theres the grey area of me making gambling machines XD and hooking it into ncr but then again laws and other mess with that


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 16:21:32
content:
  well nested sessions with open world nodes is possible all it does is make the logix open the world for you but then your still in old one unless some close world logix is done


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 16:30:12
edit_date: 2023-03-11 16:30:29
content:
  https://imgur.com/a/ZkzPMde we have a similar system just without the 360 image though we could probably do it


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 16:34:27
edit_date: 2023-03-11 16:35:19
content:
  but like im not against ncr integration with worlds its just the issue is a majority of users use steam build for ease of use and updating and due to steam policy not allowing any crypto games it had to be removed and alot of users who join wont be able to interact with the world and will probably feel left out


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 16:40:29
edit_date: 2023-03-11 16:40:41
content:
  Ofc also support for mobile usage like quest and pico and pico 4 enterprise which got eye and face track


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 16:41:41
content:
  for that to happen asset limitations would have to be in place or tags to tag something as pc or mobile without that it aint happening those devices dont have alot of ram


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 16:43:52
content:
  like it wouldnt be too hard to keep track of transactions through a node js http get and post from neos and just have that manage stuff but meh


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 16:59:53
content:
  Just furrys are not good leaders always let drama go in the way just name 1 furry CEO that is successful


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 17:01:54
edit_date: 2023-03-11 17:02:24
content:
  just thinking about this for a second. one of the most creative hobbyists that put time into stuff for free and make content for a platform that is based on community made content kind of makes sense most of the worlds on vrc are made by furries and avatars people use, also if you own a smart watch with a heart rate monitor in it... well sorry to say the tech behind that was made by a furry XD sure the community is full of drama but that's every community every platform. the whole topic and convo was going nice and smooth and actual discussions between members was the comment really necessary if it contributes nothing ?

   also back onto weird solutions for utility we can currently integrate im working on some code to allow recording of transactions from ingame using node js will be on github when done.


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 17:06:03
content:
  alex as i said don't speculate as it just leads to damaging rumors as i'm sure he wouldnt be happy you using his name for this joke


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 18:23:06
content:
  Neos isnt an ice cream saloon. Replacing froox, if it would be possible, would mean replacing the one that created over half of the product. The time of work to understand it all would be staggering, even for a group of devs. And the team isn't only a group of individuals that know best how it works and work best with froox, but also the ones most interested in advancing the project, proven by them not letting anyone buy them. Saying that this is a simple case of replacing white collar workers is missunderstanding what neos is.


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 18:36:58
content:
  Is this the news they said would be coming soon? They said they are working hard blah blah blah... The project is no longer trustworthy. Fortunately I have invested in good projects in the past and ncr in low prices. But are the result still embarrassing.


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 18:47:46
content:
  Too bad for the wasted potential of the project. This is proof that mankind is descended from apes. 🐒🦧🦍
  Primitive things have prevented the progression of development


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 19:44:08
content:
  Karel and Frooxius have created something like Noes. Neos has such a huge potential. But the project does not get further because of the behavior like from the planet of the apes.


type: message
date: 2023-03-11 21:37:28
edit_date: 2023-03-11 21:39:12
content:
  theres a lot mentioning replacing a ceo with another person
  taking from some previous conversations all c-level is just a label.. no decision just needs to be made by one person
  you already see this by neos development, there is a team, not just froox, who agree or disagree on their own actions
  whatever "ceo" is does not need to be one person if it is not necessary, which it isn't


type: message
date: 2023-03-12 11:25:26
edit_date: 2023-03-12 11:25:39
content:
  considering i just made a plate of crackers and red leicester  and coffee then yeah i will say its going good so far


type: message
date: 2023-03-12 11:26:43
content:
  I went to a grocery store that's an extra 10 minute walk than my regular store and it had so much more cheese to choose from. But I never got there. Walking with groceries generally sucks.


type: message
date: 2023-03-12 11:27:07
content:
  I was busy dealing with a work meeting in Teams that I did entirely in Neos. Had to prepare the servers for Daylight Savings


type: message
date: 2023-03-12 11:29:16
content:
  yeah... it passed the dev teams tests... but not mine, which revealed critical issues across the board


type: message
date: 2023-03-12 15:56:16
content:
  It's crazy that you need to both pay for a sim and then also pay for pieces of land and when the sim goes down all land goes away too


type: message
date: 2023-03-12 15:57:40
content:
  I see it being cool for things like as the Minecraft plot system in popular worlds but having every world have that would be aweful


type: message
date: 2023-03-12 16:00:11
content:
  Yes, you are surly the crown example of professionalism. I am sure with your advanced perceptive abilities and confidents to be right, you will go far. Starting with your constant threats and belittling behaviour, everyone will know you are a real professional^^


type: message
date: 2023-03-12 16:00:50
content:
  But digital payments always was gonna be difficult in international games because especially USA games only accept cc which you can't get on default in eu countries


type: message
date: 2023-03-12 16:02:48
content:
  NCR was really hopeful for eu because then you wouldn't have to deal with any of that but now it's ruined 😐 hopefully Neos will intergrate still an ingame currency but just not based on crypto because that brings additional complexities with it too


type: message
date: 2023-03-12 16:04:36
content:
  Neos was always acceptend of any currency, import, export of data and information. The only thing that makes NCR special is that it is integrated into the system as being a virtual bank for secure ingame trade of that currency


type: message
date: 2023-03-12 16:10:16
content:
  working on my own system with a node js server all my stuff im working on is in a discord thread in main discord


type: message
date: 2023-03-12 16:12:14
content:
  To be fair, turkey isn't a good reference for anything related to self governance concepts... i mean its like being surprised north korea isn't all that good with personal freedoms


type: message
date: 2023-03-12 16:13:13
content:
  Netherlands has one of the worst laws regarding crypto to people that had a lot of NCR before the 1st of January 2022 rip


type: message
date: 2023-03-12 16:13:27
content:
  Actually you can refuse crypto currencies with any build of neos, its just that the steam build doesn't have NCR integration, because of rules steam set


type: message
date: 2023-03-12 16:14:26
content:
  currently its all in database it takes ncr using tip jar events and does a bunch of node stuff on a server backend for handeling


type: message
date: 2023-03-12 16:15:41
content:
  Neos is P2P. Can be self hosted, can be dedicated, but neos is not hosting servers or "land" or selling that in any form. If i am wrong, please link any reference to this.


type: message
date: 2023-03-12 16:15:42
content:
  Yes but how will the LAND ownership work? it will be like a private world for just a person how will it affect acessability and what are the advantages of buying land?


type: message
date: 2023-03-12 16:15:48
content:
  Unless they were smart and bought NCR after the value was low or sold before January 1st they have a big problem because if you had more than 50k in NCR value you need to pay the tax amount as per value januari 1st and yeah rip if you had under 50k you were lucky because then it's seen as tax free


type: message
date: 2023-03-12 16:16:37
content:
  the whole idea of land selling in neos makes no sense since u can just open a new world hosted locally on pc


type: message
date: 2023-03-12 16:17:56
content:
  The only use of land on any platform is to generate revenue. It makes neos liable for anything users do on their platform. That is against the open access approach neos has


type: message
date: 2023-03-12 16:18:54
content:
  Yea sure, everyone can do that, i did missunderstand. In that case YOU are liable for anything anyone does on your land


type: message
date: 2023-03-12 16:19:50
content:
  the host can enforce rules ontop of the guidelines but the guidelines are still enforced u break those ur still in trouble


type: message
date: 2023-03-12 16:21:52
content:
  The essence of the dispute is about the usage of funds and how rules are enforced against users. There was never any issue or sexual behaviour. You are missinformed. The incident you refering to was because of a person that was thought to be not appropriate to be a moderator, because of pre-condeptions against babyfurs. It never is or was anything about being a case of the law, just different opinions about something.


type: message
date: 2023-03-12 16:21:53
content:
  omg imagine someone running a scam callcenter on neos xD  idk why I had that thought xP
  ScammerPayback VR 😂


type: message
date: 2023-03-12 16:58:48
content:
  https://imgur.com/a/GFtr3nr here is a downscaled test since im working on it of refreshing all the grids from a database


type: message
date: 2023-03-12 17:04:07
content:
  just now working on the auction feature so people can list land they own for auction and people can bid on it


type: message
date: 2023-03-12 19:36:01
content:
  I went through turkey over the holidays every single gate in their big brand new airport is sponsored by a bitcoin exchange/company


type: message
date: 2023-03-12 19:39:30
content:
  I think your research is just too surface level read more and you'll see it's really popular in Turkey


type: message
date: 2023-03-12 19:40:25
content:
  Yeah it says the turkey central bank banned payment with crypto because of people using it more than lira causing the value of Lira to drop


type: message
date: 2023-03-12 19:43:45
content:
  https://www.euronews.com/next/2021/04/16/turkey-has-just-banned-the-use-of-cryptocurrencies-and-bitcoin-is-already-feeling-the-stra


type: message
date: 2023-03-12 19:48:56
content:
  It's the same concept as driving escooters in the Netherlands yes it's really popular but it's illegal for the reason they say it causes too much traffic congestion


type: message
date: 2023-03-12 22:35:49
content:
  I find the idea of 3D space permission systems rather interesting. Second Life sim plots are restrained to a 2D lockdown on a map with infinite height, which doesn't quite make sense for VR, where everything is infinite in all directions (or at least until floating point errors).
  It'd be handy for if (and/or when) worlds within worlds loading was made possible, since it'd allow the concept of conjoined worlds to be operated in a form of a cluster, with smaller 'room' worlds operating and connected to a bigger 'apartment' world, who in turn could also be connected to a city world, etc.
  Of course, you'd need some kind of permissions setup that acknowledges an area in 3D space has specific permissions for a set of users for such to work.


type: message
date: 2023-03-12 23:33:57
content:
  One of the killer featurs neos was ready to receive in short order (before all the trouble with the two owners) was the upgrade to have "infinite" worlds


type: message
date: 2023-03-12 23:35:02
content:
  You know that you can have multiple worlds loaded at once and quickly switch between them right? Yes, thats a side-product or lets say base of the idea that actually makes it possible to make infinite large worlds that get streamed


type: message
date: 2023-03-13 00:16:51
content:
  Dope. That was supposed to be a major deal on my previous platform. It sparked a lot of debate, though, since some people weren't keen on having portals open to their own private worlds and have resources basically pulled from another world for viewing purposes (hotlinking)


type: message
date: 2023-03-13 00:18:19
content:
  I mean, you can just do both.. Big infinite worlds, big interconnected networks of worlds and private worlds, small, created by a single server/player session


type: message
date: 2023-03-13 05:09:21
content:
  A lot of Japanese users bought NCR and were completely unaware that on the English side of the community, there was a huge furry hateboner wave on social media. They were trying to call for NCR to be removed way back before development ceased and all these problems manifest...

  The team could have spoke up in favor of people like those holders... But instead they acted cravenly and attacked them, siding with voices that implied that NCR was only held by people who never played the game, instead of the majority being held by people who actually cared about it.

  Its been talked about before that part of their strategy was to throw holders under the bus to hurt Karel. They would use NCR holders by dragging them into the frey by doing things like telling the community they want to have nothing to do with the token and also that they want to remove it and make it third party.

  If the intent was to flush out random investors for whatever ideological reason, whatever... But there was 0 care about who they were hurting in their pointless crossfire.


type: message
date: 2023-03-13 05:10:24
content:
  there was endless opportunity for devs to say "dont worry, whoever wins this internal battle, we're still committed to taking care of our funders"... But they didn't because it would make alot of foxes angry.


type: message
date: 2023-03-13 05:12:47
content:
  I dont hate furs. I hardly said anything bad. And I know my characterization of the situation is off.


type: message
date: 2023-03-13 05:13:31
content:
  Like I can suck up getting called a cryptobro and ppl assuming all kinds of shit about people who like NCR, I think they can handle getting called foxes or whatever.


type: message
date: 2023-03-13 05:15:18
content:
  We don't know without looking carefully onchain and even then it would be assumptions. We know they've been selling NCR for like 5 years now atleast? As a bonus for supporting patreon, and insiders were free to sell their stake before taking public positions against it.


type: message
date: 2023-03-13 05:16:10
content:
  Some of this drama was actually because Karel controlled withdrawls and there was legitimate fear over not being able to cash out unless HE said so


type: message
date: 2023-03-13 05:18:11
content:
  I dont know how to find out what dev owns what wallet. Its all onchain but Ive not tried to figure that out and I'd like to hope this stuff just eventually gets resolved in everyone's favor.that no one would care to.


type: message
date: 2023-03-13 10:22:50
edit_date: 2023-03-13 10:23:15
content:
  I see, there is still the confusion between NCR holders and investors. Investors are those that hold shares to Neos VR. NCR holders usually don't have any shares and aren't investors in Neos VR. However, if they got their NCR through any minting, then they are supporting Solirax financially without actually investing.


type: message
date: 2023-03-13 11:18:00
content:
  additionally... I guess this channel is no longer a suggested location for project updates, given the current ongoing... situation...


type: message
date: 2023-03-13 13:19:00
content:
  Nexulan said in game he bought a mansion with it so unless it was cap it kinda says how much he made


type: message
date: 2023-03-13 13:53:30
content:
  I am pretty sure thats not true. Most people involved in neos got totally overrun by the sudden course explosion, most of them had never seen how crypto works in the background or even knowledge and/or interest in transfering anything


type: message
date: 2023-03-13 13:55:01
content:
  Sounds unlikely, but if you have any information that substantiate it, its a open information chain.


type: message
date: 2023-03-13 13:56:20
content:
  What i have seen, the crash started with wales starting to cash in, non of them patreon or users that got it as payment for their work


type: message
date: 2023-03-13 13:59:49
edit_date: 2023-03-13 19:21:08
content:
  Not a rumor Nex has got a lot of CDFT from us that converted to NCR and was one of the first withdrawhaling and selling.


type: message
date: 2023-03-13 14:01:19
content:
  Well, technically it was thousands of $ that suddenly got worth millions over night. I am still very skeptical


type: message
date: 2023-03-13 14:02:09
edit_date: 2023-03-13 14:02:35
content:
  You don’t need millions to start a crash. A few nefarious tweets and a few hundreds of thousands is plenty panic will do the rest


type: message
date: 2023-03-13 14:04:01
edit_date: 2023-03-13 14:05:25
content:
  NCR was and is a small crypto because the scale or Neos is still small at this point, will get bugger as Neos does


type: message
date: 2023-03-13 14:05:23
content:
  can we not make baseless assumptions alex based on other people you barely know. and im sure he was joking about the whole mansion thing cus thats some shit id say as a joke too XD


type: message
date: 2023-03-13 14:05:57
content:
  I don't know if it's a mansion he moved to but it's a coincidence that he moved and was talking about buying a mansion a year before he moved


type: message
date: 2023-03-13 14:06:38
edit_date: 2023-03-13 14:07:21
content:
  and there is no proof ncr had a effect on that so all this is just hersay bullshit that is just people making stuff up to have a conversation if its not factual im just tired of baseless clames from you alex and you just come up with consipracy theorys that even you yourself admitted you love doing becuause its fun to stir rumours


type: message
date: 2023-03-13 14:06:44
content:
  You know what? I just ask him. If he really did he will tell me. I mean it would have been a smart move. ;)


type: message
date: 2023-03-13 14:09:52
content:
  well there is literally enough evidence that nex didn't buy a mansion and that moving was not caused by ncr, shrug


type: message
date: 2023-03-13 14:11:32
content:
  I mean, last time i spoke with him was nearly a year ago, but he talked about how he cant buy a new graphics card


type: message
date: 2023-03-13 14:21:38
edit_date: 2023-03-13 14:27:21
content:
  everyone asking for staking but like im more worried about the contract not having reentrancy protection  to stop malicious contract calls for transfer and transfer from functions before the first call is completed which can cause unexpected behaviour

  also some weird random unchecked return values so even if a transfer is successful the contract can still return false leading to confusion

  lack over overflow protection the safemath is basic stuff and its still possible to cause a overflow in the balance mapping

  lack of negative balance protection, so no checks if the user goes into a negative balance so in theory maliciously or somehow someone could transfer more tokens than they own but all transfers are authorised by karel i think so this is not much to worry about


type: message
date: 2023-03-13 14:29:28
content:
  Token staking involves holding a certain amount of cryptocurrency as collateral to participate in and validate transactions on a blockchain network. Stakers are rewarded with additional tokens for their participation.


type: message
date: 2023-03-13 14:39:58
content:
  what do you expect karel to do if basically everyone here says ncr dead? i could care less but what's keeping you here?


type: message
date: 2023-03-13 16:20:26
edit_date: 2023-03-13 19:22:14
content:
  Didn't the wider crypto community see NCR going up and start thirsting over the money they could make? I feel like when that happened the fate of NCR was locked in. Once they saw the price start to drop they sold right away. Why wouldn't they?


type: message
date: 2023-03-13 17:14:03
edit_date: 2023-03-13 20:36:57
content:
  November 2021 was the beginning of an example, how crypto currencies fail. If they actually "work" like that, they are uninteresting for any project and make no sense


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 06:20:57
edit_date: 2023-03-14 06:23:18
content:
  For example. "The discord community..." and then the rest of your statement. Sure that's fine as a statement and an opinion. Its got thoughts and logic.

  With the insults, its just rude though.


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 06:26:00
edit_date: 2023-03-14 06:27:20
content:
  As for 'simply an Altcoin', that can be said for literally any cryptocurrency that is not bitcoin (BTC)


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 06:29:44
content:
  Additionally, would it be that much of an issue to not copy the original source graph? The poorly print screened one is illegible.
  Also... no. Those numbers shown are, in fact, NCR's numbers during the entire event. As someone who has a respectable amount that I had intended to sell a majority a second time to further my experiences, I kept a close eye on it until it flatlined.


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 06:31:54
edit_date: 2023-03-14 12:41:24
content:
  So, the irony is that your entire statement rides on distorting "the truth and the concept," yet you just tried to do the exact same distortion you just described.
  In the normal world, we call that "Playing yourself."


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 06:39:49
content:
  It is taken derogatorily as they are not children and some furrys are different than others. You are grouping people together in a way designed to be offensive.


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 06:51:38
content:
  additionally,the people you are describing may or may not also have an NCR balance themselves, so that makes them also "investors"


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 07:01:37
content:
  Well the problem is that your collating people together. 

  Just say "some people did xyz" and "other people did blah"

  Not all Furries dislike NCR, Not all Furries like NCR

  Lots of furries aren't children. 

  Your problem is tone, its bothersome when just a few small adjustments would make your repeated messages much more reasonable.


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 07:41:20
content:
  The manner in which you express yourself shows as being terribly oversimplified, presumptuous, and blind over text alone. Using terms you're not quite sure on how they should be phrased is risky and can be extremely disrespectful to a particular collection or group of people. Furries in particular are subject to a lot of harassment and bullying online, and calling them children is largly offensive and belittling.


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 07:50:48
content:
  "whether referring to children as 'children' is offensive or inappropriate"

  The majority of our community are not children, thus calling them children is rude. You are belittling their knowledge, experience, opinions, identity etc. By comparing them to children.

  You've been told this multiple times but still use it as a term, even now when you are questioning why it is rude. We're telling you why its rude. I suggest you write this information down for future reference so you can refer to it later before you use the term "children" incorrectly once more.


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 07:54:46
edit_date: 2023-03-14 08:12:35
content:
  This is also incorrect. In the furry community there are a variety of different ideals and identities. Some users often called "other kin" or similar terms literally believe they are animals. You can look this up. There is nothing inherently wrong with "other kin" either. I don't want to run around in a forest barking like a dog but if they do, why should we stop them. 

  The majority though just use the "furry community" to explore freedom of expression, identity and character.

  For example, In the furry community you can create your own identity using a huge amount of variation and differences that for some can be freeing and interesting.


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 07:55:09
edit_date: 2023-03-14 07:55:32
content:
  You can also read about this online and I'm sure there are researchers/articles/information in your native language because there are furries who use your native language, I promise.


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 08:07:31
content:
  I'm sorry your country is like that, but most countries don't do this these days. They haven't done it for decades. There's a bunch of scientific research into this and other areas.


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 08:08:33
content:
  So, in order to continue to not offend other users. I would suggest you stop referring to them as children and instead just speak with precision of language.

  "Some users from the discord community don't like NCR" - this is a great sentence that offends no one and is totally true!


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 09:25:29
edit_date: 2023-03-14 09:26:01
content:
  Hi everyone. I am sorry to say, but MK Fund is just rude in general, and i think intended. I don't believe for a moment that this is by origin or country, as they claim. I also don't see what they try to archive by being condescending against specific groups, that have most likely nothing to do with the situation.

  We here apply this also the other way around, by not  categorizing people from "your country" as rude and immature. Its just you.


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 14:03:14
edit_date: 2023-03-14 14:05:22
content:
  Also the events are way too close together, that they can be attributed to how the price changed over time. It looks as if the price dropped even before each announcement


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 14:23:06
edit_date: 2023-03-14 14:32:49
content:
  Working in cryptocurrency has been a very interesting position for sure and creating and managing different sorts of block chains are pretty interesting. You get a lot of the 'cryptokiddies' who've never opened a a text editor other than to plug in to their favorite 9,000 decentralized currencies that are backed by yet another major currency all wondering how and why stuff even works in the first place.  The way this chart flows is more liken to something called a pump and dump. just by simple nature of how some of how stocks works. 

  Also as someone who's made a significant amount of money in the $$$,$$$'s on various types of alt coins, using just a 1500$ rig to mine back in 2019-2021 I'd look at what happened with just the chart specifically and label this at first glance without even deep diving as a pump and dump scheme. But who knows maybe I just haven't done enough research into the whole situation. I don't think this specific situation is specifically froox OR Karel's fault. It's hard to just place a finger on the blame of an individual in this particular situation.


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 14:46:52
content:
  Most I've done is operated a mining setup from those cheap USB ASICS on a Pi. It was my baptism into actual Linux operations, bash scripting, and power management and distribution (since the Pi really can't power the ASICS purely by itself). It was clunky, but I did learn quite a bit from it, which then helped acquire the position I held elsewhere


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 14:48:04
content:
  ...and doing some janky recompiling and code tweaking, because mining DOGE with a Raspberry Pi B Gen 1's GPU is just hilarious when going to the moon on the back of a snail


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 14:55:30
content:
  My smallest amount of money made since I started in 2019 was actually from mining specifically off of the 2080super before the 3060 Series cards came out. and the evga's LHR system didn't seem to be much a problem with crypto while still providing lower Watt pull from systems.


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 15:14:32
content:
  Yeah... I made only a few hundred, enough to use Humble Bundle and get my Bitcoin Adafruit badge. It was more of an education project and less of a financial adventure.


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 15:21:09
content:
  Most of my money came from the learning of how to trade and look into financial avenue of new crypto alt coins that would come out, recognize a hype train, invest in the coin, and pull out when the 'pump' phase started. Meanwhile my investment into neos vr currency was my first example of taking mined coin and spending it on projects that I liked. IE Neos VR for example I put I think about 500 in 30k out.


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 15:41:23
content:
  Well don't take this as official answers but...

  How many users? Some hundrets daily. I don't know if the team has a strategy for more players, but thats really very low priority. Scaling up is not possible as long as the current crisis is not solved. There is probably low motivation to increase users at the moment.


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 15:41:53
content:
  But we can look at the history of what happened at the timing of when the coin scaled and dropped as well and news associated with it.


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 15:43:53
content:
  what should neos do to increase users?

  any marketing plans?
  maybe participate any international conference?
  when update?
  no financial problems?
  maybe more hiring?


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 15:44:54
content:
  Additionally, we have seen when the platform was at its best about 3 quarters back. Of the alternatives, Neos stood out and held the most for the longest time... until it wasn't. The lack of updates didn't help, and I think people learning about the situation has put more of a spotlight on it


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 15:45:08
content:
  The software can't be updated (at least not a major update) as long as ownership is not cleared up, new CEO or otherwise split of parties


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 15:46:52
content:
  Yes, but its not yet finished developed. The revenue is based on pateron from the ones that want to see it continue develop. More users may mean more money from pateron, but neos doesn't need more money or developers really. More money would only be needed with more users and its cost


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 15:47:52
edit_date: 2023-03-14 15:48:04
content:
  Everything depends on the owners splitting up one way or another, before that happens its just stuck


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 15:49:18
content:
  Who would develop into that hole... if you don't know if you get payed, if you own the product or if anything you do has a positiv outcome, what would you do


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 15:50:09
content:
  But its just a fact, and sadly we can't really help... it seams there is some movement with karel saying he wants out


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 15:50:30
content:
  I don't think karel is the only one at fault or anything, but a split of any kind is good and progress


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 15:52:12
content:
  for example, if there's like 100000 users in neos... someones gonna really be in trouble if not problem solved


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 15:52:21
content:
  well, i mean karel is not entirely wrong with "Open source might solve it" but really... lets be real for a moment. If you create a product over 10 years... do you really want to give up control to the public without getting anything from it?


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 15:52:53
content:
  I am not saying open source is bad, i like open source, but saying "hey lets just do that, great idea" is denying the heart-blood froox put into it


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 15:54:35
content:
  I'd be more okay with the Second Life path on open sourcing, where only the client is released... but keyword is 'more okay' not 'gladly will accept'


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 15:54:59
content:
  either way, either outcome doesn't dismiss the fact that the situation doesn't change, open source or not


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 15:55:09
content:
  I am fine with both, i am just saying that i would not open source the game i programmed in the last 10 years. I don't want to take someone else control over my product. Its more then money, its personal


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 15:56:35
edit_date: 2023-03-14 15:56:48
content:
  wanna make money?
  or just wanna have ownership?
  or maybe there could be great vision for metaverse

  who knows what Froox would want


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 15:56:48
content:
  I don't know, but i have seen people that did cool thing (more of prove of concept) in neos that have a possible future


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 15:57:33
edit_date: 2023-03-14 15:57:46
content:
  One (yesterday?) is selling land on his private server network (constantly open world), another one made a game that is close to an MMO, by multiinstanced worlds that are "levels"


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 15:58:41
content:
  I mean... there are lots of opportunities, not the last are avatars. People that go in vr have multiple reasons, but many do it to be different or reinvent themselfs (yes thats furries but thats true for many others too)


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 15:59:41
content:
  ....I like how people seem to have forgotten that Froox owns an equal amount of the company... that's kind of why we're in this situation...


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 16:00:08
content:
  Yes, thats the problem in all of this... not him specificily owning it, but because noone owns everything


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 16:01:51
edit_date: 2023-03-14 16:02:07
content:
  oh yeah the rothernberg convertable assets to cash its not really a stake per say with voting rights so its not rly a percent


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 16:02:33
content:
  50/50 is actually the worst kind, yea ;) Usually one entity gets the 51% and control  of the product


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 16:03:49
content:
  And while neos is a product, its also nothing that can simply be sold. Without froox neos is a half-finished vr engine without any chance of being finished


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 16:04:25
content:
  IMO froox is the most stupid man in the world which he can make a 1b valued project and does what ever he wants


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 16:06:29
content:
  Also its not worth that much without the people actually knowing how it works. Its custom code and its also different then anything else


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 16:07:00
content:
  i have to keep reminding myself when you guys say project you mean the Token and not the game as they are technically separate entities  just with interop.


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 16:07:01
content:
  To get a group of programmers to understand it to the point where they could continue this project without the creator is a mute point


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 16:09:32
content:
  I might not know much about business, but i know about software that was developed by mostly a single person for 10 and more years. I tell you, any such software, no mather how good... is usually reprogrammed from the ground up. Because understanding such a thing is nearly impossible, even for multiple people that do nothing for month then trying to understand it.


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 16:09:56
content:
  even then, it took even the giants like Linden Lab a good, long while to achieve its goals of a healthy market and user base. And that was all done without being open source.


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 16:11:35
content:
  Its very hard to have an open source project that doesn't fail, expecially if open source is started later. For the same reason. Noone really understands the code^^


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 16:11:42
content:
  So knowing and understanding that it makes sense to be skeptical of what the idea of that system would do now.


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 16:12:30
edit_date: 2023-03-14 16:13:46
content:
  plus opensourcing now when so small would just cause splintering in the community similar to how when i was working on neosplus a plugin for neos that just adds tones of stuff to the game since you can add anything if u know how to code c# i could even intergrate 3rd party tokens in a plugin but the problem was interop users couldnt interact with main build users causing fracturing and killing the community


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 16:15:35
content:
  The unfortunate part of alot of this is that you're expecting people to be paid on a system that doesn't have enough financial backing to support the full integrity of the systems 'promised' not ' shown' and demanding a team of underpaid staff to just 'have faith' when they are fully aware of all the previous ways companies like this tried to make money and have failed in the past. 

  But oops, guess I didn't spend my time trying to insult one individual or any individual for that matter. Just simple, matter of fact. Oh if you did a bit more beyond surface level studies into crypto and vr platforms it would just make sense.


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 16:16:04
edit_date: 2023-03-14 16:16:19
content:
  ...actually, to be honest, anyone who was part of the VRBA are basically gone... and that was when those who were a part of the alliance could transition from one platform to another with the ability to teleport and share assets between...


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 17:39:29
content:
  That basically matches... well, hard to say. A problem with this group are how many bots are in it versus actual people, so gauging any percentages feels like a hopeless task


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 17:42:43
content:
  I guess the only way to gauge it is to check the wallet for any incoming transactions and count the number of unique ones... from there, you at least have a rough estimate


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 23:53:38
content:
  I believe Nex saying that he got a mansion can be true. And if it is, what of it? That's perfectly fine and a good thing


type: message
date: 2023-03-14 23:59:12
content:
  I believe it because Nex was at the beginning of much of this drama that caused this rift in Neos. Even before any of us knew things were bad behind the scenes, Nex and Karel were at odds. Nex requested to withdrawl his NCR and realized Karel was in chaege of transactions from game to wallet and was hesitating


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 00:00:12
content:
  Apparently Karel didnt want people withdrawing yet and was afraid of a orchestrates attack on NCR or something, so he was hesitating to process dev withdrawls. Eventually he did process them and apologize


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 00:01:51
edit_date: 2023-03-15 01:13:50
content:
  I heard the rift between karel and nex was over somethkng different and then people started spreading all kinds of false rumors about him


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 00:03:51
content:
  I dont know what it was about, I just know that fairly early on Karel apologized to him for calling him a name like a dumb green idiot or something and processed his withdrawl. This withdrawl happened back in December 2021 iirc and so yes he could have probably bought a house if were to assume


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 00:04:52
content:
  well the rumors are pretty much false, people were saying Nex was a pervert because I dunno why, they started coming out of nowhere


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 00:06:28
content:
  there's not a blockchain dev at Neos... Not a single one. And none of the team really knows how blockchains work outside of basic understandings it seems


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 00:07:23
content:
  when assholes try to imply Karel was hands off and didnt have his sleeves rolled up trying to help Neos


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 00:11:19
content:
  And I would think maybe so definitly. Automatic transfers are a must imo, but just implimenting it without it being audited and understood top to bottom like, I donn't know how that backend stuff works but I see opportunity for security holes


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 00:13:25
content:
  well crypto exchanges get attacked all the time and have had a decade of being battle tested... If one of them can have a poor implimentation, Id think the game could


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 00:16:48
content:
  Not to add to the hearsay-muddied waters, but I do recall hearing from someone that it was requested to add some automation, but it was declined. Of course, part of the reason was due to avoiding potential exploits... but considering how quickly 2FA was added as a requirement to perform a transaction every time, I'm wondering how much water even that holds...


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 01:48:15
content:
  ...hmm.. curse my bad memory. I recall someone moving in with someone else, but not who and where. Even then, this was awhile back... at least 6 or 7 months. Again, hearsay, but I do recall hearing this from the person they moved in with, but I don't know where they live.
  Even then, I don't think any Neos user lives in full luxury. Owning full body tracking is usually a massive milestone, and if that's the case, owning an oversized living quarters is a pipedream.


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 02:56:05
content:
  who cares, the point is someone is wanting to know if any of the Neos devs benefitted from NCR in a significant way


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 03:02:02
content:
  all I know is nex was wanting to cash out at around the time NCR was at its peak, which is also when clashes started escalating


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 03:04:49
content:
  well... there's another issue with releasing the numbers: 1, that's a privacy, and 2, it's crypto... so technically speaking, it can be anonymized. Even then, even if you did a basis of monitoring how much was given, you'd have to consider how much was taken out, and from there, just because it was extracted, doesn't mean anything was done with it


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 03:06:28
content:
  more or less. Plus, it'd be in Karel's best interest to NOT release that.
  Think it over: do you REALLY want the person who processes each transaction manually to be also known to release those numbers to other people just because they asked "pretty please, possibly sus?"


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 03:08:52
content:
  true... but also not true...
  What if I just wanted to give someone some NCR, and they don't have a Neos account?


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 03:10:38
content:
  We only know of tizzers how much they made enough for a sports car they said on twitter which many people seen


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 03:19:32
edit_date: 2023-03-15 03:19:48
content:
  I'd be cautious bringing any of their info up, since the last time someone viewed their public information that they posted themselves, it was considered doxing...


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 03:22:32
content:
  just mentioning it is enough. Just saying. The rules here fluctuate so much, it'd make a quantum physicist brain melt.


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 03:27:55
content:
  however, did he not do this before the pump and dump?
  Speculating will get no one anywhere... afterall, it's what piledrove NCR to the ground...
  A coin to help give financial aid to a "Meta killing metaverse" that had some tie-ins with crypto... just like what Lord Zuck said... Mayhaps it will do well and prove victorious....


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 03:29:29
content:
  for one country. Versus the rest where the markets are vastly more complex and crypto is taxed to death, making it hardly viable.


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 03:30:39
content:
  the other thing is, let's be real: most people here will ignore hearsay and assume it as fact. Say what you put here as a notion that it will be misread.
  People are too focused on a virtual symbol of wealth to understand /s or 'IMO'


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 06:45:22
content:
  That's great and all but... this isn't Turkey... nor is it a discussion about economics for a specific country...
  This is about a virtual platform with social functions and an internal editor and its complex relation to a digital currency...


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 11:24:22
content:
  Users on discord are only banned for breaching the discord guidelines, if they want to appeal they can. 

  Usually users are banned from the discord for being mean for example spreading incorrect information, insulting our users etc.


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 11:24:47
content:
  The discord guidelines are quite clear and if there are any questions those users can reach out to moderation.


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 11:26:41
content:
  We don't ban people who show support for Karel, we don't ban crypto users we ban people who break our guidelines.


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 11:33:14
content:
  This is not correct and can be proven wrong by appealing any bans there and take a look in the discord where the majority of the conversation is nothing to do with furries. 

  Put facts and evidence into your statements


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 11:36:09
content:
  Appeals are necessary because it's a moderation issue not because of the identity of moderation or the team.

  If you look at any large community you'll see the same


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 11:39:20
content:
  Plus if you want to change this, go to the discord and go talk about NCR. Then you'll self prove your own statement incorrect.


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 11:41:49
content:
  That would also be confirmation bias. 

  If you want to challenge the bias, you'll need data. Go get it.


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 11:50:09
content:
  Or perhaps its that, those who are furries feel they can't achieve their goals because of the constant unsubstantiated and unwarranted dislike of them?


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 11:53:20
content:
  That's quite an accusation there, for someone who's been making incorrect, rude and bizarre comments for many days.

  Do you have any evidence of this?


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 12:02:06
content:
  As previously mentioned if there are bans which you feel are incorrect please submit an appeal at moderation.neos.com which will correct them.


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 12:30:37
content:
  We tried before ProbablyPrime. Mk.Funds is condescending, biased, insulting and throws around false accusation without any data or actual evidence. We tried to give him our time, but at this point it might be better to just ignore them. Its not worth your time (thats my personal opinion)


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 12:31:21
edit_date: 2023-03-15 12:33:56
content:
  Sorry, but from what i have seen, any change is temporary. Any discussion beginns the same after some hours. With them lying, attacking and/or throwing threats around.


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 12:46:49
edit_date: 2023-03-15 13:18:59
content:
  In neos there are lot of different groups. Some are furries, many are... and many more are not. You don't seam to grasp what the data says. There are a lot of different  groups here, some of them strange and different to things you might not see in communities/countries where free expression of self is surpressed, but its human nature to be many things. What you have to accept is that this is just a low amount of people, in relation to the whole. It seams just to be more visible to you because it is not surpressed.


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 12:49:32
content:
  And you obviously will grasp the reality that i am not a child and still are "living my inner child" on occasion's with friends. That doesn't mean i am less intelligent, less professional or "adult" as you might describe it.


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 12:50:53
content:
  Other examples of similar activities that may appear childish but are done by adults.

  Video games, sports, acting/theatre, fiction writing, art,music


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 12:51:31
content:
  Sports is a really big one for me, I don't understand sports. But I don't go out of my way to bother anyone that likes them.


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 12:53:49
content:
  Playing games with balls, playing pretend (as in movies or theate) drawing with pretty colors... all of this extends from being a toddler to being a professional. There is no clear cut anywhere and often one feeds the other.


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 12:57:50
content:
  Different silly expressions of self (like being a furry) does often extend to being successful as adult, thats why this sort of drive exists in the first place. To be reinventing yourself, to be boundless creative... thats why there are many furries in neos. Because this game is about creation and reinventing things and even yourself. But its not limited to that obviously.


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 13:00:15
edit_date: 2023-03-15 13:00:59
content:
  But being reinventing yourself and things can look and feel different to different people. ProbablyPrime for example (as far as i know) is not a furry. Doesn't stop him from creating and (re)inventing things, his expression of self is not cute and furry, but his work is obviously very creative^^


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 13:09:12
content:
  WiFi was some $ after 1 hour free but was still less than the cost of one shake that shake shack did not have :(


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 13:11:31
edit_date: 2023-03-15 13:12:11
content:
  Yea, they are pretty modern and socially pretty close. They probably would be part of the EU by now, if not for the dictatorship


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 13:27:03
edit_date: 2023-03-15 13:29:21
content:
  Ha, my speech about "accept people for who they are" was downvoted. Seams like it wasn't unnecessary in the end to say this after all. There are still people that want to clinch to the magical world of unicorns where absolutely everyone is "normal". But the reality is that everyone pretends. Usually in public, so everyone else think they are the only ones different and join in that big game of pretend to be perceived as normal. Reality is, everyone is strange in their own way. The world where everyone is just a robot that does how they are told doesn't exist, anywhere.


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 13:54:06
edit_date: 2023-03-15 15:02:40
content:
  i certainly wish more people accepted others..
  barring any ideals that can be seen as harmful etc. you-know-what-these-are
  i'd like to just live and let live :p


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 16:03:38
content:
  I can't pretend to be normal it causes lot of bad situations like some restaurant owner yelling at me for putting my bike where he put chairs in front of the bike parking place


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 16:06:55
content:
  Or the chicken pie that was new at the baking section at lidl but it smelled off so I put it back and then a man said something to me and followed me through the store


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 16:10:56
content:
  At this point, it is hardly worth coming up with examples. If every excuse given from this group was documented, it'd be a novel with the possibility of a trilogy not being far behind.


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 16:13:15
content:
  When I see a pile of trash at the container I have to see what useful stuff is in there that I can fix and donate I do this a lot that's certainly not normal but is fun


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 16:15:57
content:
  Considering the responses given in this channel, that is an ill-advised action. Give praise, and it is met with distain. Give criticisms, and it is met with unrelated hostility. Give a thoughtful argument, and it is met with factless drabble.


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 16:16:37
content:
  Even if that is not an accurate description of the whole, despite the size, so few actually mutter words here.


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 16:17:16
content:
  In a sense, the "vocal minority" have indeed become a representation of the whole... because they are the only ones to speak.


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 16:22:48
content:
  They used to be interesting and raised good debates. That is no longer the case, it seems. Even then, from the sidelines, to say the actions that do take place here are viewed with disappointment would be an understatement. While the rest of the world moves forward, this and the topic have become locked.


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 16:32:47
edit_date: 2023-03-15 16:38:41
content:
  More importantly, when rather significant issues arose, which could have had a notable action against the project's value, no information was ever mentioned here, nor did anyone else notice it. I continue to observe that virtually no one here, besides "those from discord," has actually tried what the collective "has invested in." Even a Tesla investor has at least SEEN one of their cars and may have even gotten to look them around.
  I've seen a distinctive difference: some people uphold a very powerful mindset and are also in Neos. I've yet to see that reflective here, and based on past mentions that Neos "has nothing to do with NCR," it shows that the true intentions were never about funding a project like it was in the past and was entirely for self-profit.


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 17:44:15
edit_date: 2023-03-15 17:47:29
content:
  Pretending to be normal to some point is fine. To act in accord to expectations makes it easier for everyone. I just wanted to point out that people are so used to pretend they are "normal" that they start to believe that the act everyone puts up is actual reality.


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 18:04:37
content:
  I know thats not realteable to many of you, but there are people that like to remove their cloth at home, as soon as they go inside... they would like to do that all the time, but thats not socially acceptable.
  Or others that like to talk with everyone naturally, but they don't, because thats an elevator, or a toilet, and you don't do that on a toilet.
  Others may just love the sun, would like to stand there in the middle of the sidewalk, but don't do that because they are self concious of being watched.
  Some may feel the need for attention or singing or running instead of walking in public. But you can not do that, because thats not normal.

  Me? Its even worse with me as a babyfur.
  When i see children having fun in a ball pit, i feel like "i wanna too", but this is obviously not publicly acceptable, so i am happy for the children having fun and go my way.
  I am stressed, i often see other adults sucking on their glowing pacifiers they call cigarrets... but its not socially acceptable to use an actual pacifier, so i obviously smile and try to calm myself down without (not succumbing to the need of a drug like nicotin to help with that)

  So never forget, normal is just a very narrow fitting to expectations ;)


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 18:26:10
edit_date: 2023-03-15 18:26:34
content:
  I think the bigger takeaway is that Neos, VRC, Chillout, and even Overte all are designed with self-expression in mind, where you can be yourself if you create an avatar to your image... but you'll be amongst other unlike the norm, including "a gorilla or a dragon or a giant talking penis in the Metaverse." You could go to a cafe and just do work, or you can be floating in space without a need or care for air, or underwater, where barometric pressure be damned.


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 18:34:19
edit_date: 2023-03-15 18:34:41
content:
  just showing people here because i'm bored just working on some simple logix nodes inside of neosvr to interact with some crypto stuff and learning how the nethereum library works https://imgur.com/a/B2kNe76


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 18:35:39
edit_date: 2023-03-15 18:36:05
content:
  yeah figuring out the code for the token price node was a pain since the api is using graphql ill try to find a replacement but eh for now


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 18:37:08
content:
  Its fine. One of the most done error in neos is done by actual programmers that learned how to program before going into neos. Its making big, interconnectec programs with hundets of logix nodes


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 18:37:58
content:
  What makes logicx so powerful is exactly not do that, but making small, independend functions or objects that relay information to each other (if nessesary) or work independently with 20 commands tops


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 18:39:48
content:
  For me, I definitely need to look into making custom nodes... mostly to act as shortcuts for when doing projects


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 18:41:05
content:
  The only problem with the plugin system is that the code only runs on your system with your plugin obviously


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 18:41:15
content:
  That's something I do like about Node-RED, is that when making a custom function, you can specify the inputs and outputs. If there was like a RedPrint system or whatever that allowed similar packing, it'd be very interesting to see what more could be done with that sort of thing


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 18:41:29
content:
  BUT you can make it in a way (if you want) that they relay the result, so that it at least works when you are in the world


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 18:43:40
content:
  Yes, true, but the expectation should always be that others don't have your plugins. The 3 categories of plugins are "fully compatible" (usually something that doesn't creates information that needs be relayed or actually changes something in the world others need to see, for personal use like interface parts), "relays" (only works with the plugins installed, but puts the generated information in a form that can be perceived by everyone in the world, even without the plugin) and "game breaking" (others need to have that plugin to see it or even join your world)


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 18:48:52
content:
  Plugin system is really nice to make a total conversion, but usually you want to keep compatible to other players. I mean a connected vr world is only half as fun without... connections


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 18:49:22
edit_date: 2023-03-15 18:49:34
content:
  Mods are the glue in between to make actual useful things that can even work well enough to be somewhat not game breaking, even if the other player doesn't have it


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 18:51:48
edit_date: 2023-03-15 18:52:08
content:
  kinda fights what i was aiming for neosplus is like a game modpack its just a plugin full of nodes and weird features and we max had around 12 users on the plugin just to play with stuff wait no near 20 when the jp users came on it because of clothsim


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 19:36:13
content:
  Short answer: not really
  Elongated answer: Unless you enjoy the discussions of "Thou are a furry, therefor art thou hateful," still no


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 20:49:47
edit_date: 2023-03-15 20:56:02
content:
  I'm just wanting us to get our game back. Just sick of the gridlock, really want something to happen.


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 21:38:54
content:
  Nah you can still play in a ball pit or crawl through a indoor climb place you know the ones with the slides and everything is padded and those rollers and ball canons there is like the autism group events that do those things too those places can be rented and such I went there a lot it's lot of fun and I'm not a baby fur or anything


type: message
date: 2023-03-15 23:52:18
edit_date: 2023-03-15 23:52:35
content:
  Honestly at this point, neos will not get any meaningful updates until karel leaves his position. The team will always refuse to work with him, and that's just how it is.

  I hope karel can accept that and move on, because this is just hurting VR as a whole.


type: message
date: 2023-03-16 00:03:13
content:
  Also, karel. You say that the team doesn't understand you, but honestly, I think you don't understand the team.


type: message
date: 2023-03-16 00:26:39
content:
  Its both. Karel means well i think and he seams to really care about the project, but there is also a point where you have to let go. This point was pretty much reached years ago. So i am not sure if something changes soon. I would be happy to see it, and even happier if karel and froox try for their own vision of neos each, even if that means to split the community to a point, but i think its totally worth it, because of its potential.


type: message
date: 2023-03-16 00:27:10
content:
  And if not, well, froox should get control and should get the chance to fail... or prevail, with his own vision.


type: message
date: 2023-03-16 03:39:22
content:
  It is incorrect to say "the furries", some furries like Karel, some furries don't. 

  Try again, how about "Why do so many people hate Karel so much?"

  See it makes your statements more relatable, logical and reasonable.


type: message
date: 2023-03-16 03:52:54
content:
  aren't the dev team volunteers? As in, it isn't exactly mandatory. Considering the people involved would have to be dealing with the code, having trusted people deal with it would a large criteria so... good friends are fairly trustworthy at times...


type: message
date: 2023-03-16 03:53:22
content:
  People dislike the project to stand still. I would very much prefer, as i have said, karel to make its own copy of the project and going ahead do his own thing + froox developing his vision of neos. I don't dislike karel, i dislike stagnation.


type: message
date: 2023-03-16 03:54:18
content:
  that's a path I'd be fine with...  afterall, Karel has had a great amount of success finding a new team


type: message
date: 2023-03-16 03:56:17
content:
  Thank you, for once this is a sentence that doesn't insult anyone. Its an opinion and a statement. 

  Now of course I don't agree but that's totally ok! I'm just happy its at least reasonably polite.


type: message
date: 2023-03-16 03:57:41
content:
  Its also the other way around. Its not that froox allowed to many close friends to become part of the development team, but he made many close friends in the development team over the years. Obviously, people that shared his vision and creation.


type: message
date: 2023-03-16 04:06:13
content:
  Well, he does pay it with the money that people give him by promiss of using it for that purpose... Its not his money, but yes, he could do that. As a result he would be unfit for the role as CEO and replaced by law... and the thing would end too


type: message
date: 2023-03-16 04:06:54
content:
  But he is a professional, he would not just do something that hurts him and everyone else just out of spite.


type: message
date: 2023-03-16 04:24:43
content:
  Technically, nothing the dev team has done has resulted in the systems to stop functioning. Karel suepending the cloud storage, on the other hand, is basically destroying the heart of the system, which is almost mandatory to function.


type: message
date: 2023-03-16 04:47:24
content:
  To put this out bluntly... everyone pretends to do their job. Dev team patches if there are major issues, karel pays the services (or has most likely an automatic payment setup)


type: message
date: 2023-03-16 04:48:07
content:
  Both do the minimum required to keep it running to be technically doing their job. None of them want to break this, i strongly assume. But its not a good long term plan.


type: message
date: 2023-03-16 08:42:26
edit_date: 2023-03-16 09:21:25
content:
  I mean this kinda thing has happened before XD
  Take a look at Arm China a year ago: https://www.pcgamer.com/arm-china-rogue-ceo-ousted/


type: message
date: 2023-03-16 08:59:35
content:
  considering how many people here seem to just want to return to trading NCR, by any means, despite the fact the platform defines the value of the token. Of course, the same people also don't seem to acknowledge that


type: message
date: 2023-03-16 09:14:36
content:
  additionally, that's very petty to want to tear down the system all because the token's value plummeted, which was... never designed for trading in the first place? It was to act as a way to fund the project, not speculate value, and considering the stale development... a lowered value makes sense


type: message
date: 2023-03-16 10:23:24
content:
  there are also some supporters inside the furry community too. 

  please stop speaking in absolutes, you were almost there.


type: message
date: 2023-03-16 10:30:26
content:
  No this time, I'm not complaining about you insulting them.

  This time I'm complaining at your absoluteness of statements. 

  My goal is to ensure you realize that there's bias in your statements that can easily be reduced and omitted which makes your arguments, stronger and easier to read. Here's a hint, if you use the term "furry" at all you've missed the point.

  There are furries and non-furries who both support and do not support Karel/NCR the point is you don't necessarily have to be a furry to not support him and you don't need to NOT be a furry to support him. 

  It helps you realize the bias in your arguments which leads them to be better typed and full of less flaws.


type: message
date: 2023-03-16 10:35:15
content:
  They are likely in here, this channel. They're likely just not keen on speaking up because of your history in referring to them.


type: message
date: 2023-03-16 10:41:31
content:
  Except... what pro users? Karel hasn't answered many subscribers to that service, and most I know have terminated it. Additionally, per his own statement, he's been unable to hire any new developers, as he intends to only pay via ETH. Considering that ETH is at least more healthy by comparison in the trading market, that alone should show that there's just no interest in cryptocurrencies as a serious system in the tech sector, as ironic as it may be.


type: message
date: 2023-03-16 12:13:42
edit_date: 2023-03-16 12:15:51
content:
  See, thats why i said it doesn't make sense to take time to teach Mk.Fund. It seams like his only goal is to be condescending, agression, continuing to spread false claims and pinning his own failures on others. Every change of that is temporary and the next time you speak to them, bam, it starts up again and takes time of everyone.


type: message
date: 2023-03-16 12:21:35
content:
  Its funny that the one person that titled others as "children" and "immature" requires the most getting spoon fed and is still not able to eat. I genuinely think they are just a bad person. Sounds rough, but thats pretty much how i feel.


type: message
date: 2023-03-16 13:49:41
content:
  Hmm, yea, well i am happy that still so many people stand by Froox and Karel after all that time, but it would be really good for everyone if something would move. And really, what i would like the most to see would be a split of the two parties and two projects that try going different ways to maximize the chance of success. Also would solve the deadlock over the code ownership.


type: message
date: 2023-03-16 15:00:23
edit_date: 2023-03-16 15:10:10
content:
  Because none* of Neos moderators have any ability to moderate here, The only 3 able to moderate here are Karel, Andrea, and Nonny.


type: message
date: 2023-03-16 15:02:12
content:
  Technically there are also the 2 random bots, one of which rarely does anything, the other is actually useless as it covers a feature that was just toggled on the channel instead.


type: message
date: 2023-03-16 15:02:22
edit_date: 2023-03-16 15:57:13
content:
  I am one, I have never had anything personal against Karel as he hasn't done anything directly or indirectly to harm me. I recognize that flaws exist in many people and I do not hate him because of any actions he has taken that I did not support. I support him in hopes that he is able to find solutions for himself, his family, and is able to grow beyond the current situation.


type: message
date: 2023-03-16 15:29:18
content:
  this channel has been on repeat for the better part of a year, no progress gets made here despite the constant conversation
  same "the furries" vs. "karel co." even though neither side seems to actually exist
  just a distraction from real issues and getting in the way of anything meaningful


type: message
date: 2023-03-16 15:40:11
content:
  While Funds behaviour is vile and stupid, please don't give Fund the time of day. We tried, really tried. It is obvious to anyone they are trolling by now, so lets just ignore them and wait until moderation does their job.


type: message
date: 2023-03-16 16:28:38
edit_date: 2023-03-16 16:29:20
content:
  It was a run around. He repeated the same false claims, attacked people, belittling them, described a conspiracy of furries taking Karels rights and wealth, hiding behind his origin like "oh yea, in my country everyone is hating furries and people that are not having investments".

  We told him not to be condescending, ProbablyPrime tried to teach them how to use arguments instead of blunt attacks, lies and prejudice. He was thanked by being described as a furry (against any objective reality) and as such nothing he is saying is of any value.

  In short, his behaviour against others and this group was worth the ban, and as it happend repeatetly over 2 days, it is likely that control isn't his strong suit.


type: message
date: 2023-03-16 16:48:37
content:
  Hmm, well i can't say i envy him for that. If true, i would be angry too. But creating convenient lies and attacking random people isn't a solution. In fact if all of what he made up would be true, it still would not help to spew poison in a random chat. I mean the value of NCR rises and falls with the success of Neos. I can't imagine how this success would be impacted positive by this behaviour. That is the reason why i think this talk about investment is a lie too.


type: message
date: 2023-03-16 18:10:09
content:
  Also, I would like to point out that almost everyone lost. Many in-world users were Patreon backers, who had been given minted NCR throughout their backing period, often going many years. During the spike, many were excited but equally confused. Given the value has dropped to near its starting point, it's safe to say that no matter how much was invested, be it a million, a few thousand, or even just $100 in the long run, those users, myself included, lost YEARS worth backing in the flash of an eye... and no one did anything.

  In short, the frustration is mutual, not exclusive.


type: message
date: 2023-03-16 18:26:30
edit_date: 2023-03-16 22:06:41
content:
  That and much of their misconceptions were gladly accepted as truth here... case in point...
  "He told the truth about the drama."
  Except, no, they didn't. People here just grasped at it as something to cling to, and that is why it appears to be truth, when it often was very baseless.


type: message
date: 2023-03-16 19:10:30
content:
  I was watching it but didn't bother responding to any of it...Just amazed is was lasting that long lol


type: message
date: 2023-03-16 21:39:55
content:
  It is excellent that when users break the rules here they are banned. Regardless of who or what they are and what they represent.

  I will raise a glass of cheese.


type: message
date: 2023-03-17 00:33:18
content:
  you mean like the <REDACTED> who still patrols silently and somehow wants <REDACTED> in addition to attention?


type: message
date: 2023-03-17 05:43:18
edit_date: 2023-03-17 13:04:02
content:
  Karel Thank you for your dedication. I put hundreds of thousands of dollars in when you said you would be the captain to take us through the storm. I hope you can handle the handover properly. I truly hope you give it another try. My mentor is a genius, he has two communities of hundreds of thousands of people, and his friends have billions of dollars in btc, and they have backed sandbox. you should know that the future of this space is in a position to have a few hundred billion dollar market cap projects, and I don't want it to be a scammer gamefi company, or a fool virtual land, artificially created scarcity project that succeeds. neos has a great good community. I am the least educated person here. I have no money to come to the world of cryptocurrency. I had fun in the world of cryptocurrencies, of course I made a lot of wealth and missed out on a lot because I wasn't brave enough. I fell this time, I invested in a future winner I thought was a mistake, smart people only bet on strong teams. I was ridiculed by my VR insider friends around me who don't understand cryptocurrency, why do you think neos vr will win? They would all bet on meta. i saw a lot of star companies valued at $1.5 billion at ethdenver this time, over commercialized and don't care about the community. I'm starting to understand how the community members of neos think. We cryptocurrencies only have communities anymore. Traditional finance has more money. Then there are the tech companies that promote and advertise very hard on sxsw. I hope neos vr pays attention to this in the future, cryptocurrency projects are not good at promoting and promoting, only scammer projects are good at promoting.


type: message
date: 2023-03-17 06:24:32
edit_date: 2023-03-17 06:39:23
content:
  I met a friend who made a public chain, he was originally in the garment business, he made a public chain and finally lost to Ethereum .He told me that at first the ethereum community was the teenage dream. And not like now it seems that only people from top2 schools can realize the dream.


type: message
date: 2023-03-17 08:54:38
content:
  Rough translation of above message:
  You would get nothing after staking, as there's no profitability in this project at all


type: message
date: 2023-03-19 13:58:05
content:
  There is one called Deep Dreams, it's full of beautiful glowing jelly fish so that would be my favourite together with this one I just discovered ....


type: message
date: 2023-03-19 22:50:03
content:
  Hmmm... I mean, if the only changes were to a string and an external binary, fixing the MMC thing is just a hex editor away.


type: message
date: 2023-03-20 07:54:06
content:
  more or less. Considering the platform has had no updates, a major event resulting in tons of creation occurred, and the value of the token itself hasn't changed in reflection of that (if anything, it went down entirely when the MMC was announced and even further towards the end of February), it's pretty safe to assume it's flatlined at $0.09


type: message
date: 2023-03-20 07:55:53
content:
  If a major event, with prize money and the innovation of newer concepts and ideas isn't enough to make NCR fluctuate in any direction, "she's dead, Jim."


type: message
date: 2023-03-20 08:42:42
content:
  A market place system was in the "to be worked on" features, but at the moment, the only markets for NCR are internally, which are used to pay off cloud storage, and exchanges, where speculation resulted in collapse


type: message
date: 2023-03-20 08:44:07
content:
  So, technically speaking, if people wanted the most direct and easy way to exchange for fiat, one could consider talking with people in-world who need extended cloud storage space, but aren't interested in the Patreon. However, this only works with the in-world wallet, and not an external one


type: message
date: 2023-03-20 10:28:11
content:
  What is outdated in your opinion? The lack of updates I understand but I'm curious about out of date things.


type: message
date: 2023-03-20 11:21:44
content:
  yeah.... I was onboard for many years... it just would be murder to attempt to withdraw now... let alone, assuming it'd even go through since that process is still manually done


type: message
date: 2023-03-20 11:43:34
edit_date: 2023-03-20 11:43:40
content:
  Karel upset a lot of people and investors with his unprofessional actions, so i'm not sure that will happen.


type: message
date: 2023-03-20 11:45:18
content:
  steam does not since steam policy forbids crypto implementations the website build over at neos.com or you can log in on the neos website and on the profile it shows ncr ammount


type: message
date: 2023-03-20 12:03:55
content:
  Just to point out. Has nothing to do with neos. Steam banned neos at one point for integrating crypto


type: message
date: 2023-03-21 21:11:47
content:
  Doing alright. Just wrapping up work after last night's discovery regarding the latency of RTMP not changing, even if using my old junker VPS from 2016


type: message
date: 2023-03-23 06:56:25
content:
  A plugin. Not a mod but a big package of changes to add to the functions of neos. Not compatible to any neos user not having it


type: message
date: 2023-03-23 07:10:54
content:
  It also demos a bit of an issue with the open source route... While NEOS+ adds a ton of features, that fork would be incompatible with the base viewer. Unless a ruleset akin to what Linden Lab established with Second Life, where any forks of the client MUST retain the same experience between eachother (as in, no exclusive things like breast physics or other entity animation overriding), you'll create a situation where the userbase gets split apart


type: message
date: 2023-03-23 07:13:17
content:
  That being said, it doesn't mean that once updates do start coming out, that NEOS+ could be viewed as a way to experiment with newer ideas and concepts that could become real systems in the base client


type: message
date: 2023-03-23 07:40:20
content:
  There is a difference between mods and plugins in my opinion. Mods can enrich the base experience and plugins have their usages for class rooms or other isolated cases


type: message
date: 2023-03-23 07:41:32
content:
  But splitting the main user base is a no-no, so plugins for half the user and half not, currently not a good thing, while i do appreciate the effort behind it


type: message
date: 2023-03-23 11:41:50
content:
  neos+ can be used, sort of
  at the very least, left enabled, but you cannot use any of its features in normal sessions
  it does not provide enough features for the downside of such incompatibility so remains mostly experimental and for fun


type: message
date: 2023-03-23 19:59:43
content:
  I'm curious, will the neos vr team be willing to have exhibitors go to GDC? Or do you not want the public to play your platform?


type: message
date: 2023-03-23 20:01:04
content:
  Neither however, means that we do or do not want someone to use our platform. I think its strange to think that attending an event signifies our desires.


type: message
date: 2023-03-23 20:02:21
content:
  This year there were a very large number of web3 companies exhibiting. I met a lot of game fans on site, which touched me, they really love games. I introduced them to neos vr


type: message
date: 2023-03-23 20:04:44
content:
  I mean, anyone right now can go on Steam or the website, jump into Neos without an account, and do whatever. There aren't any restrictions in place


type: message
date: 2023-03-23 20:05:20
content:
  As long as the team and cto settle, neos vr could very well become a 100 billion market cap crypto project. I know some rich people who have backed such a project. I can go try to convince them.


type: message
date: 2023-03-23 20:07:03
content:
  That may be the case but I dont think any of it has to do with one event(GDC).

  Of course I'd like for us to be at every event, but who knows where "event attendance/travel" is on the budget :)


type: message
date: 2023-03-23 20:07:55
content:
  That, and you'd have to consider the general user scope... and uh... well, let's just say crypto isn't the hottest topic right now...
  (especially right now)


type: message
date: 2023-03-23 20:11:12
content:
  seeing as "the game industry .. looks down on web3 game companies" advertising neos as such is surely the worst thing possible


type: message
date: 2023-03-23 20:13:26
content:
  Last time I was there, I ended up at an ID@Xbox party, played giant jenga, got drunk and ate a ton of buffet food \o/


type: message
date: 2023-03-23 20:14:31
content:
  No, just because some game companies are too profitable now. And those who enter web3 are scam game companies. neos vr is not, it has a strong community


type: message
date: 2023-03-23 20:16:04
content:
  I talked to the staff of meta, their former startup also intended to make their own engine, and then found that the engine is a platform, they gave up.


type: message
date: 2023-03-23 20:16:42
content:
  But... why is it a strong community? That's the core reason why it wouldn't work...
  The community is not based around NCR or Web3 systems; It's based on the systems Neos itself offers and the common interest of socializing and sharing creations


type: message
date: 2023-03-23 20:18:03
content:
  The employees of meta are all vr enthusiasts. They have lost too much money because of hardware, so now they want to earn back through software


type: message
date: 2023-03-23 20:21:18
content:
  That's just because you don't have access to web3. Yesterday arb gave everyone $4,000 each, which will affect many young people's lives


type: message
date: 2023-03-23 20:25:21
content:
  Then I went to the pico vr and they had a particularly large booth. I realized I knew their software product leader


type: message
date: 2023-03-23 20:25:28
content:
  You seem to be dodging and missing the point.
  Value is in the eye of the beholder, and much of what goes on in Neos, and many other systems, has content creation happening constantly all the time, being exchanged and shown off without tender being exchanged, because finances aren't the point. Anyone, right now, with only the setup of an application, can access this.
  What's the requirement to access this magical Web3 and is it only based on finances?


type: message
date: 2023-03-23 20:49:08
content:
  I'm going to take a safe assumption that 'airdrops' usually are to help spread the market so that trading is incentivized or to help promote new products based around a system? Neos had that, and it got played. Even then, there is only storage rental use, so the most people could have in the current market is exchange in-world tokens for more storage... which lasts an entire month.

  At 5 NCR per GB per Month, people can easily just get by for less than two US quarters per month... so what'd be the point of dropping NCR on people when it'd just be used so slowly anyway...


type: message
date: 2023-03-23 20:53:57
content:
  That's just the way it is. There was only an exchange-by-hands system in place, not a systematic process... and what was systematic has clearly become laughably so pointless, it makes the desire to have NCR increase in value kind of fruitless.

  Right now, I'm sitting on a nice horde and the amount of time I have racked up right now? Enough to last me a very healthy and plentiful amount of time and space...

  And not once have I touched an exchange. And this isn't unique to only myself.


type: message
date: 2023-03-23 21:01:25
content:
  I mean, that's kind of what you get when you only hold interest in something purely for its finances: it's been sucked dry, and now you just have its hollow husk.

  And no, "the people of Neos" had nothing to do with its value dropping. If anything, the continued efforts to use, create, and enjoy the platform, despite the ongoing events, should have given the token more value.

  And maybe it did, but with so many people just focusing on value, on raw numbers, the worth of it just continued to be drained despite the possible gains.

  I continued, from the beginning, to point out how few people here actually looked around, actually took time to learn about the product they were "investing in," and to see this be the endpoint, the footnote of this chapter...

  No other author could have composed as fitting of an ending. That has been this channel's only creation.


type: message
date: 2023-03-24 06:36:38
content:
  if the last set of messages are to go by, he is taking in applications for people who want to take his position, which said applications can be sent to karelwantsout@neos.com. Any inquiries for business or any other partnerships are still to go to hello@neos.com


type: message
date: 2023-03-24 10:50:03
content:
  We did have a list in the readme but it was too long if you would like I can add. It back but probs as a wiki page


type: message
date: 2023-03-24 10:51:25
content:
  Yeah we have a few things json parsing nodes,collections,custom shaders,the weird cloth physics that everyone seemed to like and a bunch of logix nodes that people just request


type: message
date: 2023-03-24 10:54:13
content:
  Tho recently been working on a launcher so we can use 3rd party dlls such as nethereum or anything that we need to implement a logix or component


type: message
date: 2023-03-24 11:19:59
content:
  It does cause some confusion, Its why generally I don't recommend suffixing or prefixing community projects with Neos.


type: message
date: 2023-03-24 11:20:46
edit_date: 2023-03-24 11:20:58
content:
  Ooo 👀 
  tbh it won't improve my experience because the base game itself already runs at 12 - 30 FPS on my PC xP


type: message
date: 2023-03-24 11:22:35
edit_date: 2023-03-24 11:23:10
content:
  I wonder if there's a mod to remove all cameras locally, wharever someone spawns a camera my FPS drops to 4 xP


type: message
date: 2023-03-24 11:27:23
content:
  There is one that does that as more of a side effect of trying to disable mirrors locally. Mirrors also use cameras


type: message
date: 2023-03-24 16:13:07
edit_date: 2023-03-24 16:54:48
content:
  cto and the team announced a settlement, ncr will go up immediately. Now is a good time to do a small successful project. The rest depends on how much talent we have. I know a very talented person who reads two hours a day, but he needs at least a few hundred thousand dollars a year


type: message
date: 2023-03-24 16:22:10
content:
  I still want neos vr to be this successful project. But it needs to reconcile and then come up with a sexy story.


type: message
date: 2023-03-24 16:23:39
content:
  I like the corporate culture of neos vr, disruptive innovation, innovate at the expense of killing yourself. eth community is all about that. You guys are very similar.


type: message
date: 2023-03-24 16:41:42
content:
  not sure corporate culture is an exact way to describe everything...
  I mean, if what you say is true, then failure to truly result in destruction also means failure, and fully resulting in termination also means nothing is carried on, particularly in this case...


type: message
date: 2023-03-24 16:54:56
content:
  What do you think of the Korean valeg hardware product? Just over $800, but you need to order from ten


type: message
date: 2023-03-24 16:56:40
content:
  zk and sui can go to experience, what do you feel, I recently received tens of thousands of consecutive, thousands of dollars, feel quite good


type: message
date: 2023-03-24 17:00:37
content:
  The problem with my English level. I mean if the CTO and team are willing to settle, the token price of ncr will go up immediately. I don't think reconciliation is possible myself


type: message
date: 2023-03-24 17:08:25
content:
  Well, if a settlement is made, ideally the two would go on their own separate paths. The thing is, so much damage has been done, it'll be difficult for both the platform and the token to ever recover. Thing is, the token would get the backseat treatment if settled as originally intended, being made as a financial plug-in


type: message
date: 2023-03-25 15:45:48
content:
  I'm just a fan of his, I'm not really peter thiel, but my mentor is as smart as he is. So I also hope karel doesn't make excuses, I see his Czech traits, good math and humor. After my mentor was cheated out of a million dollars he borrowed from a friend, he borrowed a few hundred thousand dollars and made 80 million dollars in a year to lead a community of a million people onward. During his hardest time, it was our community that kept donating to invest in his business.


type: message
date: 2023-03-25 15:51:49
content:
  Also karel or the community must have someone step up to the plate, my mentor forced himself to read two hours a day. He bought all the books on the market about cryptocurrency before he could read bitcoin and then explain it to us in detail. So my days of holding btc were a lot of fun. I've seen people who think they're geniuses and weren't able to read enough books during the startup process


type: message
date: 2023-03-30 11:45:26
content:
  Hey there, communication in this channel should be conducted in English only. Not sure what you are asking for trying google translate either.


type: message
date: 2023-03-30 13:30:48
edit_date: 2023-03-30 17:58:34
content:
  "It seems that the person is asking about a specific project and inquiring whether it has started its marketing campaign or not." - ChatGPT


type: message
date: 2023-03-30 14:09:33
content:
  Translations is actually something that ChatGPT is pretty good at. Its factual informations that it stumbles


type: message
date: 2023-03-30 16:16:45
edit_date: 2023-03-30 18:02:21
content:
  目前没有针对 NCR 的营销计划，而且 Neos 本身与 NCR 是分开的。另外，请注意，本聊天室仅支持英文。如果您想用中文交流，请加入我们的 Discord 频道，并使用专门的中文聊天室。如有任何官方业务咨询，请发送电子邮件至 hello@neos.com。


type: message
date: 2023-04-01 01:47:59
content:
  yeah. I just tried that myself. Logins are all now expired. Server is online and responds to network requests


type: message
date: 2023-04-01 01:54:36
content:
  Karel, @malooniac, and @NonnyFreedom, might want to see the above and poke the appropriate parties when able to...


type: message
date: 2023-04-01 01:58:32
content:
  huh.... how come the website login still works? I'm guessing it has a different access to the API system?


type: message
date: 2023-04-01 02:01:52
content:
  Hi, it’s Xaos and her GPT-3 Bartender 💜🤖😎
  I wish the introduction was more happy, but I’m just getting a heart attack as I’m set to exhibit the Quantum Bar at Laval Virtual next week & open it on NEOS regularly afterwards.
  Is there a way that this can be fixed?


type: message
date: 2023-04-01 02:02:17
content:
  Seems like the api subdomain might only be used for the game itself. the website uses cloudx.azurewebsites.net/api/


type: message
date: 2023-04-01 02:20:19
edit_date: 2023-04-01 02:20:55
content:
  Copying over Primes announcement in Discord 
  "We're aware of users getting SSL issues when using Neos. I'll update you when I can.

  We're aware and investigating, thank you.

  We're implementing some fixes"


type: message
date: 2023-04-01 02:24:06
content:
  FYI, there's no indication that this is an expired cert. The Client Hello is immediately rejected and no Cert is offered.


type: message
date: 2023-04-01 02:24:47
content:
  It is something either in Cloudflare's service, or possibly the backend API being down that might result in the error, but I am speculating since I don't have experience in Cloudflare's API protection services.


type: message
date: 2023-04-01 02:26:37
content:
  The Client Hello includes the CN (api.neos.com) since Cloudflare likely uses that to direct to the proper backend hose, but immediately a TLS response is returned saying handshake failure.


type: message
date: 2023-04-01 02:27:42
content:
  That's an assumption made from the browser since the Client Hello offers all of the schemes and TLS compatibility and then it gets an immediate handshake failure


type: message
date: 2023-04-01 02:28:18
content:
  But since 132 cyphers and TLS 1.2-1.3 is likely offered, my guess is the issue is not the TLS versions nor cipher, but something in the backend having an issue with the CN


type: message
date: 2023-04-01 02:30:23
content:
  From Prime in Discord

  "We're seeing partial recovery here, still some fixes to roll out. 

  You'll need to restart Steam to pickup a small Neos update."


type: message
date: 2023-04-01 03:10:57
content:
  hmm... weird. It seemed to work even without... regardless, I did update but I need to run the Yt-DL updater again


type: message
date: 2023-04-01 03:14:19
edit_date: 2023-04-01 03:14:52
content:
  Not sure personally if the yt-dl or mmc facet update ever actually got pushed to standalone, I just copied the dll from my steam copy to standalone and updated yt-dl manually previously


type: message
date: 2023-04-01 03:15:26
content:
  well, if you update standalone, it also reverts the changes so... not a big deal, since I still have the script from back then.


type: message
date: 2023-04-02 17:26:43
content:
  I'm wondering if there are trolls here or if they are just naive or if they deliberately want to kill Neos.


type: message
date: 2023-04-02 21:26:07
content:
  So if Karel does manage to revive NCR, will there be anything to retain coin value? That's what kills most coins from what I can tell, that once it starts to lose value, people bail with what profits they can still get, naturally.


type: message
date: 2023-04-02 21:28:58
content:
  After it's initial usage as a way of funding, I don't know what the purpose of it is anymore ¯\_(ツ)_/¯


type: message
date: 2023-04-02 21:45:39
content:
  The value of it is only useful to me as a utility token. I get, I spend, I receive storage space. As commerce, it fails on too many levels


type: message
date: 2023-04-02 21:55:45
content:
  Though, that does bother me: what is the REAL reason separation is so tricky? Is it due to the ownership percentages? Is that why simply changing hands is 'the desired' way over just... biting the bullet, liquidizing everything, and have both people go their separate ways and let this be the end of the madness?


type: message
date: 2023-04-03 00:08:17
edit_date: 2023-04-03 03:00:23
content:
  I'm really hoping they go their own ways. I came to neos for frooxs work, and want to continue seeing what he can do with the platform. I wanna see if Karel could create something utilizing crypto/web3/whatever well, I've not really seen anything convincing me of it's true utility so far. Neither of these are truly possible as the situation stands.


type: message
date: 2023-04-03 01:33:06
content:
  lovely... welp, considering the platform and coin are both degrading, to the point of holding zero meaning to any party, it'll be nice to know that because someone couldn't be bothered to just let it go and keep the proceeds, that two birds were killed by one stone.


type: message
date: 2023-04-03 01:37:01
content:
  At some point, so many workarounds will be instated, Neos, the client application, will be a true demonstration of the ship of Thesis, in that it is so disconnected from the original system, that it might as well be considered something else.
  NCR will most likely go the same way, if it hasn't already done so, in that it was once a token to support the development of a system, but was turned into a trading nightmare when Meta opened their mouth and made the wrong crowd pump and dump on a donation system.
  Thinking about that more, I truly wonder if other cases also occurred that were similar in nature... good intentions, spoiled by stupidity and greed.


type: message
date: 2023-04-03 14:41:51
edit_date: 2023-04-03 14:42:06
content:
  I don't think any of that would be productive. This can only end one way and its a final split of the two owners. I would prefer two projects, but any outcome beside stagnation is preferable.


type: message
date: 2023-04-03 14:54:31
edit_date: 2023-04-03 14:55:01
content:
  The hot topic has now shifted to AI. they can separate on their own merits and see what they can make in the future.


type: message
date: 2023-04-03 15:01:35
content:
  In my personal opinion, hot topic means nothing. Sure the AI's are changing our lifes in the next few years in so many ways that it will be hard to grasp for many, but in terms of software development for VR it doesn't change that much, yet. If there is any hardware release, like a more immersive way to access VR, any time in the future, you will see how fast VR crazes come up again.


type: message
date: 2023-04-03 23:14:49
edit_date: 2023-04-04 18:19:18
content:
  Besides, a project that melds the 'hot topic' and VR together is on life support because of this dilemma. A few MMC projects even showcased the functions.
  Additionally, Karel already stated his opinions on letting Froox operate everything from his perspective. I'm not even sure Froox has a Telegram, let alone would be allowed to join this group without people throwing virtual pitchforks.


type: message
date: 2023-04-05 06:06:04
content:
  It was updated just a bit earlier today, just hasn't gotten those 2 things specifically I suppose. Both of which are user fixable if you'd like them fixed sooner.


type: message
date: 2023-04-05 06:08:24
content:
  Can't confirm myself on those as I have made my own changes to the facet and have already updated yt-dlp


type: message
date: 2023-04-05 06:09:44
edit_date: 2023-04-05 06:09:59
content:
  Announced by Prime ~1hour ago in the announcement channel
   "We've released a further update on Steam,Standalone and Headless to cover some issues users saw with the last update. 

  You may need to restart steam and/or wait a little bit to see the update. 

  It should resolve, thumbnails & videos being funky. Thank you!

  Edit: Until everyone/everything(including headlesesses) are on this new build, some thumbnails may still fail to work. So if you're testing stuff make sure to only look at sessions that have all the updates. Thanks! "


type: message
date: 2023-04-05 06:18:06
content:
  2022.1.28.1310 and 2022.1.28.1335 are the current 2 latest 'versions'. The version number has not been incremented the last few fixes as they are all compatible with each other


type: message
date: 2023-04-05 08:45:07
content:
  That is correct. Development is on hold until ownership is clearned up. To be blunt, until the two owner split up and finalize law proceedings


type: message
date: 2023-04-05 10:09:12
edit_date: 2023-04-06 18:33:04
content:
  Also, as someone who uses the standalone viewer exclusively, it has been getting updates, albeit only critical ones. As there are effectively 4 different primary platform builds (Steam Windows, Steam Linux, Standalone Windows, and Headless), there might be a few differences due to platform requirements, but should still retain the ability to function together, which I can confirm on all 4 accounts.


type: message
date: 2023-04-05 13:05:59
content:
  neos has released non-breaking updates often before, so slightly different build number is not a problem
  it is also actually just a 25 minute difference between the two


type: message
date: 2023-04-05 19:17:04
edit_date: 2023-04-05 19:24:33
content:
  NeosVR #strong on TV in Austria .
  https://www.puls24.at/video/wirtschaft24/revolution-metaverse/v-crj3gcze82fd
  (Mostly german, partly english. )


type: message
date: 2023-04-05 20:17:03
content:
  Hmm... went okay until the talk regarding blockchain stuff came into play. So far, it has been very sketchy with "smaller, individual artists" (using my transcription translation, which is passable, but has some errors). I do agree, however, that the 'hype' phase has more or less passed, and as companies change to different subjects (with AI now being the new hot topic which was mentioned with Meta and Microsoft all taking metaverse funding and shoving it in that), it's also important to understand the tech itself.


type: message
date: 2023-04-05 20:18:20
content:
  Overall, the discussion topics were... interesting? However, I'm not sure how long ago the interview was done, since the platform's health is dying right now and falling heavily behind from where it could be


type: message
date: 2023-04-06 03:54:46
content:
  Yeah, to be fair all I saw it was planned for is just being the neos version of linden dollars or whatever


type: message
date: 2023-04-06 16:10:02
edit_date: 2023-04-07 16:05:54
content:
  But what if they are right? What if we've been dead this whole time and an all powerful evil demon is just tricking us into thinking we're living our lives and posting to the official Neos Metaverse telegram as an elaborate form of psychological torture. Doomed to doom scroll for our transgressions against the immutable distributed-consensus protocol. Husks of our former selves, mere echos in the session announcement servers. D:


type: message
date: 2023-04-06 18:04:22
content:
  Honestly, that wouldn't surprise me with how long things have dragged on. This Telegram group feels like a circle of Hell that was never finished and collectively takes from the world's recent events and slurries them to form a new type of nightmare.


type: message
date: 2023-04-06 19:53:24
content:
  It's been probably discussed already, but just in case, can anybody link to the update regarding api.neos.com?
  It's throwing 525. (was since march 31st?)
  Does the game still work?
  New domain maybe?


type: message
date: 2023-04-06 19:56:17
content:
  Someone in the channel did write something about this. The newest steam release should have the changed api-adresses and another release is upcoming


type: message
date: 2023-04-06 20:01:24
content:
  https://discord.com/channels/402159838827905024/439421931830378506/1093040932867293274 here is the latest announcement in discord with some more info in the posts above it


type: message
date: 2023-04-06 20:02:38
content:
  Updates have been pushed out to Steam, Standalone and Headless changing api.neos.com urls to cloudx.azurewebsites.net ones


type: message
date: 2023-04-06 23:27:50
content:
  What's do you think is sketchy about a TV-moderator asking about big money hype and luxury brands entering the metaverse and someone (me) saying that he is sceptical of that and believes more in the metaverse as a motor for individual arts&craft people and seeing NFT and big money promises sceptical?


type: message
date: 2023-04-07 00:04:49
content:
  I cannot speak German, so I could only go based on what the transcription said, which had to be done with a translator app, so I could only make out parts of it.


type: message
date: 2023-04-07 00:06:31
content:
  I can try to copy what the transcription came up with, but it was struggling  and was always a good 5-10 seconds behind


type: message
date: 2023-04-07 17:12:51
content:
  What do you use for transcription since this is special player and doesnt have the luxury of youtube auto subtitles.


type: message
date: 2023-04-08 09:06:14
content:
  Hello guys , ive been holding ncr for very long time , havent been checking the price for so long, and now i see its crashing very badly . Maybe you know whats going on?


type: message
date: 2023-04-08 09:54:57
content:
  No idea
  There are lower risk projects that promise more profits.
  But will watch it and possibly get back in again


type: message
date: 2023-04-08 10:08:32
edit_date: 2023-04-08 10:19:09
content:
  I don't see any efforts to promote the project towards NCR.

  The community does not understand the potential in my opinion.

  It may be that the team is trying to dump the price to pump it later.

  The market has more lucrative projects to offer from an investor's perspective.

  The NEOS platform is still unique.
  Therefore, I will observe the whole thing from a distance.


type: message
date: 2023-04-08 11:53:42
content:
  Well, perhaps meta would have finally have a product worth using that way. But no, because neos is owned by two people who don't want to sell it to meta. And meta would not buy a 50% share, even if one of them would offer. There is no 51% or 100% to gain , so its not worth anything to them.


type: message
date: 2023-04-08 12:18:42
content:
  So many people had they hands in it and im still here having like 95% losses but this hopping for a miracle


type: message
date: 2023-04-08 16:13:05
content:
  Why the hell karel wants to leave? He is the only one who cared about NCR! I remember all team wants to get rid of NCR of im wrong?


type: message
date: 2023-04-08 16:55:34
content:
  But there is nothing i see in discord or enywhere , what is the future or is there a future at all or is there any type of actions which going to be placed?


type: message
date: 2023-04-08 18:10:07
content:
  The issue will always be that to maintain a presence with Steam, which was the primary way of accessing Neos, NCR cannot be linked. With the split of two versions, one with access and one without, I'm not too confident with NCR's future, especially given the few situations it is now tied to.

  Anyone with half a mind will look at the values, see signs of a pump and dump, and hold it to extreme caution, only made worse by the footnotes of what transpired during it.


type: message
date: 2023-04-08 18:12:36
content:
  Equally speaking, I'm not sure on Neos's future as Neos, simply due to the event going on, and due to how many rumors have been spread because of it. Only a handful of users were there when a certain other platform announced a full ban on crypto, and the amount of backlash that Neos had to deal with from their 'loyal' userbase... which isn't small.


type: message
date: 2023-04-08 18:19:06
content:
  IMO, allowing NCR to be tradable ultimately is what made it what it is now: worthless. Had it been only allowed to remain within the system's infrastructure, but still allowed to be purchased via what it was intended for: support to the project. The moment people realized they could game the system, that's exactly what happened, and now here we all are: without value and with a platform that is sitting on thinning ice.

  So, no one got what they wanted due to NCR.


type: message
date: 2023-04-08 18:22:14
content:
  But whatever. With a group full of mostly crypto bots, and the remainder either some users of the platform or people who think that by owning a digital metal they have a sense of importance and entitlement to a title, I often question if it's worth even discussing anything here, as those in the know already know (the users), those who aren't just want to ignore everything (the false-investors), or couldn't care due to programming (bots).


type: message
date: 2023-04-08 18:37:39
content:
  We're already starting to see that. I'm not versed with Chillout's changelog of critical features, but VRC hasn't been slouching at all. Heck, they introduced a feature that will dramatically improve rendering performance at a minimal expense. Heck, even the open source project, Overte, has been making progress again


type: message
date: 2023-04-08 18:47:33
content:
  Yes, I should stop supporting web2 people to start their own business and should stop being idealistic in the future. Shouldn't be giving support to furry community


type: message
date: 2023-04-08 18:54:43
edit_date: 2023-04-08 18:56:22
content:
  What else do I need to explain to idiots who don't even know that the most basic application of cryptocurrency is shares?


type: message
date: 2023-04-08 18:58:55
content:
  Try what your meta-universe would be like without cryptocurrency as the bottom layer. You deserve to live in the brave new world


type: message
date: 2023-04-08 22:04:45
content:
  part of that seemed to be recourse from adding eac
  but i guess it would need to keep adding things eventually, and it's definitely not bad


type: message
date: 2023-04-10 01:45:10
edit_date: 2023-04-10 03:22:52
content:
  The real split in the community occurred in mid-December 2021 with the discord poll about NCR staking. There may have been internal stuff before then, but this was the first time publicly anyways that most people learned of a problem between the team. That was followed by months of silence from Froox and speculation on Twitter/Discord. 

  Investors hate uncertainty more than anything and IMO was the main driver of the price depreciation (along with overall decline in the crypto market at the time). The lack of communication by EVERYONE involved, including Karel AND Froox, was THE major problem from an investment perspective and why so many large holders, like FantomKnight and myself, ended up selling their bags. 

  So yes, I stand by my statement that posting a timeline with one post by Froox in February 2022 with no context, as if that absolves him of all responsibility prior to that point and lays the blame solely with Karel, is absolutely misleading.


type: message
date: 2023-04-10 01:51:22
content:
  Ok sure, but I've seen that (or similar chart) and argument multiple times—not necessarily by you—to try making the point that it was all Karel and not Froox that led to the price drop


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 12:23:09
content:
  I'd imagine so. atleast for the 'patient' in this case. observers or someone guiding through might not. I haven't looked into it much but it specifically mentions ' using built-in VR-based eye-tracking'


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 12:29:07
content:
  I mean it is a partnership with a vr headset maker (Varjo). Tracking eye movements, patterns and reactions to various stimulus is part of how some of those are diagnosed


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 12:31:14
content:
  If it was a brain scan only, this article probably wouldn't exist as is? part of the point is that it is using VR technologies


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 12:46:46
content:
  The take "oh yea but others might get diagnosed too, so i am less special" isn't the point of this at all.


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 12:47:15
content:
  That is an oversimplification to say the least. The point is to improve diagnosis by allowing much better examination and being able to record the results and relook at them. Current diagnosis takes place in person and done mostly manually.


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 12:47:51
content:
  People self diagnose or get stupid opinions from doctors that want only money. Has nothing to do with factual data.


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 12:48:40
content:
  Not sure on how well the what sounds to be machine learning portion will be as it'd need quite a lot of data before becoming useful. Even if that is a flop the data collection for diagnosis should much better.


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 12:49:34
content:
  Or time to punish the ones with diagnosis disability by forcing them into a less than minimum wage environment or else homeless that will make people think twice about faking it


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 12:49:42
content:
  Well, human beings suck, we are fragile and have a lot of problems. Humans are apes with anxiety, because we are trying to scratch on the limits of what biological brains was meant to do


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 12:50:17
content:
  The ones that faking it without evidence are kind of totally different from the one that get diagnosed with it by any reasonable scientifical methode


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 12:52:36
edit_date: 2023-04-13 12:52:43
content:
  Using vr for diagnosis people think it's nice but then they get diagnosis and then stuck to less than minimum wage jobs forever


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 12:55:16
content:
  I don't life there, but netherlands i am hard pressed to even believe you. As far as i know they have very similar take on social security then most other european country and that is: you don't starve, die of illness or exposure, no mather if you work or not


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 12:56:54
content:
  "The Dutch Participation Act (Participatiewet, in Dutch) has been drawn up to guarantee everybody's right to access to work, to make sure that work-disabled people also can find a job. The jobs agreement (in Dutch) is part of the Dutch Participation Act. According to the jobs agreement, employers in the market sector must supply 100,000 jobs for work-disabled people by 2026."


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 12:57:07
content:
  https://www.bnnvara.nl/kassa/artikelen/levenslang-in-de-bijstand-door-participatiewet-het-verhaal-van-esmee


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 13:01:43
content:
  Thats not what the participation act is about. If they dropped support for people that can't work, thats not that law in the least^^


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 13:03:54
content:
  So whats the issue. That there is no particular law made for the chronical ill to make a good living but instead being on the social security list for unemployed?


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 13:04:56
content:
  That has nothing to do with each other. Thats not what this law is about at all. There is a law missing to support the ones that can't work. But they didn't thought of it being nessesary, because everyone unemployed gets social protection anyway


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 13:04:57
content:
  With the old ssdi you could move to another country there was no limit on saving there was no not allowed to sell items


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 13:05:51
content:
  Once a year you need to buy something with the savings else if you go over they take away the unemployment


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 13:06:40
content:
  Well, if you don't life in the country where you are supported from, you probably don't get the support for long anymore. And the reason for social security limits on ownership is to make sure that people that decide they don't want to work don't get rich of not working. That actually was a problem here


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 13:07:12
content:
  The people with disability should get a total different treatment, yea, but i can't vote for the netherlands


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 13:08:30
content:
  Social security is the last step if you are not proven to be very sick AND don't get a job for a very long time


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 13:09:05
content:
  It doesn't appear that the second you have some diagnosis you are removed from whatever assets or job you have and forced into it. It seems to be more a system that catches people who are unable to work because of a disability to help them either locate a job that fits their ability or atleast provide a minimum to survive as far as food goes


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 13:09:09
content:
  Then you get payed everything inkluding food, living, basic added benefits, in exchange for you proving that you can't sustain yourself


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 13:09:50
content:
  So that social security is the last step and is only applied to the ones that don't get other benefits already that make them able to sustain themselfs


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 13:11:05
content:
  Here you got 2 types one is short term disability like broken arm or something and long term is jobless income which goes via municipality


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 13:11:05
content:
  But this doesn't apply to the life long sick here in the same way. Yes they get social security as well, but they get additional help too


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 13:11:49
content:
  The short time disability one is nice you get 70% of last income and no limit on saving and selling items


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 13:13:00
content:
  The thing about social security is, its a choise. If you don't want to prove your income, you get the very minimum of base income that is just enough to simply sustain yourself. That may be... 1200€


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 13:13:40
content:
  But if you prove you are forced to life in this particular home, because you have no other, you need a new washing machine, or you can't clean yourself, you need a new bed, because you can't afford one... THATS where social security gets  in


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 13:14:08
content:
  Where you prove what you don't have and its given to you if required.. in exchange you have to prove what you really have


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 13:14:30
content:
  Anyhow I will gently mention that this is no longer on topic for this channel as it has moved away from the VR tech originally posted about. (4.2)


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 13:15:06
content:
  Well to that... i think its a great extension of making people aware and doing preliminary diagnoses


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 13:16:07
content:
  If nothing else. improvements to the eye tracking would likely come to other devices and platforms anyhow


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 13:16:56
content:
  You only get unemployment when you are under 6k in sai gs so if you have more you need to spend that first on living and no not allowed to buy something expensive with it because they check and calculate how long the over 6k you got lasts


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 13:18:10
content:
  thats bad... well here social security is: "if you need it you got it, in exchange you have to tell us what you have, everything. If you have to much, you don't get anything more then unemployment benefit"


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 13:20:53
content:
  No, you have to apply for it and someone helps you with all your expenses and income and payes for everything that you need. If you don't comply with the rules you back on basic benefits


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 13:21:30
content:
  Like a new bed, new heater, new... think of things that cost like 20.000$ that noone on benefits could ever buy


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 13:22:55
content:
  I mean, noone really wants to be on social security. It has the assigned feeling of failed and noone would overshare being on it. But its important its there to catch you if you really mess up


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 13:24:23
content:
  well no, unemployment benefit or rater "emergency help" (i hope i translated that right) is always 1200€


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 13:25:29
content:
  haha, yea perhaps. Austria is nice, but you also need to be citizen. Otherwise you only get help from immigration ;)


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 13:29:09
content:
  Well, i mean the laws are reasonable in my opinion. If you finally get out of the hole of social security, that means holding a job, you have a higher income automaticly and are no in it by default


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 13:29:23
content:
  My hope is that they change this law so I can have my job remotely in Germany with income from there and regular income not unemployment


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 13:30:19
content:
  Hmm, yea. I hope it works out for you and where you life. But i have to say. I understand people not wanting to follow rules and laws, but there is a reason the only begger is known by name, isn't there


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 13:31:19
content:
  And also proves that you can choose to not follow the rules, if you are ok with the consequences. And you don't die of hunger obviously, because that 1200€ is way enough for beer ;)


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 13:31:34
content:
  In Germany the ein euro job is like it you get paid 1 euro from the job and the rest paid from unemployment


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 13:32:19
content:
  yes, that 1€ jobs are basicly just a means to reinsert people back into the job market. People that do it chose to do so, because technically there is no advantage for them, beside being back at work.


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 13:32:52
content:
  Over here it's calculated so it might be 3 euro or 4 from the job and the rest is from unemployment but I really hope they change the law and make it if you work full time at a job you get paid from something else from the government that isn't unemployment laws


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 13:33:36
content:
  Here you can work a hand full of hours in addition to benefits, but not much. If you work full time, you have to make sure that full time job can support you obviously


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 13:34:08
content:
  Or the job has to pay full salary but that is difficult when having diagnosis and in participation act


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 13:38:20
content:
  Actually would my diagnosis be valid in another country if not then problem solved automatic get paid everything from the company


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 13:39:04
content:
  but people from russia at the moment get actual added immigration benefits, because they can prove they would get possibly killed if they get back (everyone male and relative young can claim that at the moment)


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 13:43:13
content:
  its good to have a strong workers society where such things go automaticly... or there will be strikes (never really happens)


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 14:23:31
content:
  ....parden my french, but what the <REDACTED> does this have to do with Neos other than the matching name of a research project?


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 14:34:36
content:
  bruh... did you even read the article?
  It has nothing to do with the metaverse. If anything, it does, however, raise a good point of concern with increased biological data being made available on various services, since the Vario is like jam-packed with stuff if I recall, and we could see this becoming the new norm


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 14:43:05
content:
  I can speak to what they're doing here and in these cases they very much can and need to do this stuff. They're automating testing for a number of very serious brain conditions that can be found by movements of the eyes. This is actually taking subjective measures (a human observing) and throwing an objective data layer ontop of that assessment


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 14:44:21
content:
  So... similar to like the eye checks by medical personnel after an accident, but for more deeper analysis?


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 14:44:50
content:
  It's similar to how we use ECG testing to validate heart trouble. The ECG outputs wave forms and a doctor examines those wave forms to find heart attacks or arithmyia etc


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 14:47:52
content:
  For me, I'm a sucker for data and being able to visualize it in exciting ways. I don't have a fancy ECG, but heart rate information is pretty snazzy to play around with, especially with their cheap availability.


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 14:48:42
content:
  ...Actually, didn't Varjo partner with someone last year for BCI stuff? I wonder if that can/is used in conjunction with the eye data


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 14:49:09
content:
  Alex appears to have not read the article and jumped to conclusions.

  I also have some of the tests this app will do implemented in actual neos and we have an expert in the area in the community.


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 14:52:25
content:
  Hmm....
  So, this was something that was brought up back during my time with HiFi: we actually had a few therapists come in with high interest of integrating VR support as a means of alternative remote sessions (mind you, this was back in 2017, so non-pandemic related). A concern was the legal requirements of security and data retention (namely, no logs or something manageable).


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 14:53:06
content:
  There is also the possibility of using this to replace the subjective roadside alcohol assessment which can have bias. The way your eyes move is very out of your conscious control in so many ways


type: message
date: 2023-04-13 14:55:42
content:
  hmm... that could be interesting, but I could also see it being concerning within current VR use cases. For example, say a club has an 'eye checker' that monitors for 'overly intoxicated' eye movements. While handy for preventing people from getting sloshed, it's also a bit earie knowing the information is presented and that accessable, even if it improves the experience


type: message
date: 2023-04-14 15:54:42
content:
  What new partner? As far as i know the two parties have still not solved their internal troubles and none of the owners have left. As such new partners would obviously be counter productive right now?


type: message
date: 2023-04-14 15:57:12
content:
  Its asking for new computers and a printer in the middle of a hostage situation... "excuse me, you with the gun. Can you talk to my boss about a raise?"


type: message
date: 2023-04-16 19:56:24
content:
  Hmm... given the situation thus far, many contacts of mine have begun to lose hope that anything will ever change. I've already have started to double my workflow by planning my works to be placed on another system that gives more control, mostly in part to avoid what befallen this one.


type: message
date: 2023-04-16 20:00:44
content:
  Data rot is starting to occur, the lemmings that flood this channel who only care about a dead coin, and a 'CEO' who clearly only cares about the death of his own creations, the general outlook on the platform and the poor knowledge on the situation resulting in lost hope... need I go on with what I keep hearing?


type: message
date: 2023-04-16 21:08:45
content:
  at what point do we have to wait until the legal entity's organization defaults to "This person doesn't exist." because of all this?


type: message
date: 2023-04-16 21:11:09
content:
  I mean, let's be real: no matter how you put it, Karel is acting like a complete child.
  If his 'investors' care, then they should be furious he's still funding a system that he CLEARLY has an issue with, and thus burning their money.
  And people who use the platform are furious because they are watching every other platform basically speed on by with progression all because of the halted development.
  As a leader, he's absolutely failed, especially when he basically doxxed himself by releasing the PDF receipts for when Neos was at it's first possible second wind moment.


type: message
date: 2023-04-16 21:14:11
content:
  "Oh, I want someone to replace me." THen leave, genius.
  "But they have to be worthy of my position." You clearly don't care.
  "I don't want to make my investors upset." Beggers don't get to be choosers.


type: message
date: 2023-04-16 22:36:10
content:
  Nothing stopping a Neos user who can code to write a plug-in to implement there own tokens XD so why ncr


type: message
date: 2023-04-16 23:38:03
edit_date: 2023-04-16 23:38:46
content:
  Why fork the coin the code in it is outdated and abysmal and has a few security flaws but ignoring those for a second it’s just a basic coin where the mint and all transactions was manual compared to other coins it’s inferior


type: message
date: 2023-04-16 23:46:15
edit_date: 2023-04-17 02:38:55
content:
  Eh, could be better. Been remaining optimistic, but reality is knocking on my door and I'm realizing I need an escape plan still.


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 02:44:08
edit_date: 2023-04-17 02:49:42
content:
  1) the current token is on a old solidity version 
  2) no protection against reentrancy attacks such as malicious calls to transfer or transfer from functions and calls back to the contract before the first call completes causing unexpected behaviour 
  3) no negative balance protection and the contract does not check for this at all
  4) unchecked return values such as transfer. And transfer from are not checked so they can return false even if transaction is successful causing errors and confusion 
  5)lack of input validation at all for transfer transfer from and approve
  6) lack of good overflow protection sure basic safe math implementation is all right for few years ago but this can cause issues in balance mapping

  Sure saying to everyone you don’t know what your on about might work most the time but man I decided to humour your little comment as I’m bored and tired and I’m just a programmer, also henceforth I’ll ignore any other convos just trolling from you as it’s kinda just annoying


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 02:49:10
content:
  snapshotting and making your own fork of the token, no one's talking about forking its code or whatever youre on about


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 02:51:59
content:
  Conversational confusion doesn't mean that someone doesn't know something it just means your questions or topic are confusing or easily mistaken.


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 02:53:21
content:
  are you talking about problems with how ncr is handled in neos client or are you saying there was ever anyone coding anything for this erc20 aside from how the minting contract is set up?


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 02:54:26
edit_date: 2023-04-17 02:55:45
content:
  Oh the mint is manual that’s been confirmed multiple times by team and Karel also the approval of withdrawals from the game there also was some time where they was trying to push for it to be automated but probable can probably clarify that


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 02:57:30
edit_date: 2023-04-17 02:58:05
content:
  Have u not read the smart contract behind the token ? The code that makes it function aka the solidity file or .sol


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 02:58:01
content:
  and that doesnt have anything to do with why neos team can't snapshot and fork it then do whatever the hell they want to with its contract


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 03:04:07
content:
  No clue 🤷‍♀️ but it’s a template with mish mash parts. By the looks of it https://etherscan.io/token/0xdb5c3c46e28b53a39c255aa39a411dd64e5fed9c#code#L1 that’s what I’m looking at the code. Page for the contract solidity 0.4 which is heavily out of date


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 03:09:58
edit_date: 2023-04-17 03:10:24
content:
  I’m not part of the team just a normal user I just learned. Solidity as I was bored And had nothing else to do. Plus what’s wrong with having a extra skill


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 03:14:21
edit_date: 2023-04-17 03:14:50
content:
  That’s the part I had to spend the most time on. Implementations of security methods without breaking something else later on


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 03:18:05
content:
  you make it sound like there's an even more strong case to shapshot ncr and fix its issues, both with ownership and apparently the contract


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 03:19:09
content:
  I'm guessing that'd entirely be on Karel to deal with, since he has the wallet files, and thus the private keys needed to correctly handle such? Though I'm guessing you can snapshot publicly, but for applying fixes...


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 03:23:09
content:
  .....anyone can just... update the token's code...?
  Is that even.. a good idea? Like, that sounds like.... really bad...


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 03:31:00
content:
  you snapshot the chain, then deploy the updated token with the changes you want. the old ncr still exists, its just depreciated


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 03:32:09
content:
  i dont k ow why i felt kike bringing it up other than to remind everyone its a possibility and something ive advocated for like over a year


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 03:34:29
content:
  that's... just forking... I mean... the original NCR's code would still be running, and the snapshotted one with the newer code would just be its own thing, based on the values from previous... Not sure how that really fixes the core issue of the platform being stuck in the mud


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 03:37:04
content:
  that wasn't what I was shocked about at all. Forking stuff and doing something elsewhere isn't new. My concern, as it was perceived by original reading, that ANYONE could modify the original contract's code and have it applied to the same primary track, ie the original NCR token


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 03:43:41
content:
  updating NCR honestly really isn't an issue right now. Frankly, I'm not even sure why there'd be a concern to even touch it if it's remaining functional, unless there was a desire to do a full fork of both the platform and its financial system... but there was hardly a tie to begin with, so nothing is exactly lost if one or the other collasped


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 03:47:44
content:
  then.... okay? Then wouldn't the snapshot be taken when he resigns? Even then, not like the dev team or the new magical CEO would get the wallet file, unless it was marked as company property


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 03:57:48
content:
  Considering it's been more than a year, the 'lord and savior' of this channel hasn't even consulted a lawyer, nor has talked to the team regarding any form of negotiations (if the last outburst is to go by), I wouldn't hold it against them to follow protocol with the transfer of assets correctly, let alone the fact of there being multiple entities of which it could (or could not) be located under


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 05:46:47
content:
  Why did NCR need to be so tightly integrated with neos anyways? Wouldn't have having it as an addon be better for allowing user choice? That's what I thought NCR was supposed to be treated as when someone explained it to me the first time.


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 05:48:28
content:
  In a nutshell, that was the proposal given when all this stuff started to go south and no agreement could be made. By creating a finances API of sorts, it'd allow other services to be possible, with NCR being dubbed the 'official' add-on for NeosVR's financial system, or something to the lines of that


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 05:49:15
content:
  however, as it stands, it's hardly tied in at all. If ETH's entire system went into a blazing infernal, taking all the token systems along with it, NeosVR would still function just fine.


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 05:50:20
content:
  Fair. I just wish I could have been able to choose not to contribute to the NCR market with my Patreon sub


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 05:51:18
content:
  I mean, you can opt out, but I'd strongly advise against that. Part of the reason is because the NCR you receive can be used to increase your storage space further, even if you drop the patreon rankings


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 14:28:01
content:
  It's not tightly integrated.

  The reason it's a thing to begin with is to help fund Neos development.

  It's been being sold to users since 2018 or something, and serves several purposes. So when you push that it should be some third party addon it's kind of inconsiderate to all of those users who put their money into Neos.

  If you don't want to interact with NCR, just play with the Steam client or ignore it on standalone which is extremely easy to do.


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 14:28:46
content:
  when people suggest NCR be a third-party addon, lets call it what it is: the half-thoughtless suggestion from motivated anti-crypto advocates.


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 14:55:09
edit_date: 2023-04-17 15:57:37
content:
  I did not put money into NCR, but I did put time into it
  A whole month of work during MMC22 and I end up with storage tokens (which is fine) instead of usable currency
  of course the spirit of a competition should not fall on the idea of prize money, but the anticipation of a large reward disappearing under your nose is a bit of a discouragement
  really the failure of NCR would be the only reason so many people would want it third party in the first place: why would you want a direct connection of that to your platform? Not to add to everything else that Neos and the team are under so far
  everyone got crossed, I've given up on it and I as well as others notice this and want it sidelined


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 14:56:22
content:
  even then, this falls under a personal feeling i suppose
  if you still think ncr can succeed, that's up to you


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 14:58:17
content:
  Why fund a project with something that could lose its value in days? Like, if it had mechanisms to prevent that it'd be different, but, y'know, the NCR crash.


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 15:00:39
content:
  I mean, I used, bought and sold NCR for commission work in Neos, so I’m not anti crypto, I used it for the very purpose it was made for. I’m just antagonised by this thing and the stalemate attached to it that I just want it gone. 

  It could of worked. 

  It didn’t work. 

  Strip it out and move on.

  I want the project to live and thrive, and I’m happy to have NCR dragged out into third party or whatever for that to continue without this total halt.


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 15:01:56
content:
  ncr alone, not really; but the eth used to mint ncr, yes
  who knows where all that has gone, though
  by now the only funding is the neos patreon that helps keep the servers alive
  along with the rest of the neos team putting in seemingly countless hours into keeping neos running, a truly dead platform would be barely usable a year in and it's been two


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 15:05:50
content:
  Fair
  Karel has given an impossible ultimatum. He can't seriously think anyone would come to replace him with neos in its current state.


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 15:10:19
content:
  the thing is, no one needs to replace him
  there is not necessarily any person that needs to fill that role, if i remember correctly it's been mentioned already that the neos team as a whole can perform all of his responsibilities


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 15:12:59
content:
  That too, and if someone replaces him we could have this whole situation all over again depending on who shows up


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 15:14:09
content:
  blegh, I don't want to care about this situation any longer, I'm going to go cry staring at logix instead


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 16:02:02
content:
  how would killing NCR help Neos in any way other than help you personally get this weird emotional closure you feel you need?


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 16:05:36
content:
  NCR didn't fail, it was just attacked in crossfire by the team and its own community. The devs threw the NCR holders under the bus by dragging them into the drama between them and Karel when NCR has absolutely nothing to do with that.


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 16:09:07
content:
  I personally think NCR works fine, you can use it to tip people still and its there for those who want to experiment or build with it. It works -because- its a feature inside of Neos


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 16:12:19
content:
  I can’t, I’m not going to get involved. 

  I don’t care if it stays or goes. I just want this unique and lovely project and community to get some lifeblood back. 

  I will agree to disagree and leave it at that, Orc.


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 16:20:39
content:
  It seems lots of people want to post how they don't really care about this thing, yet want it to be removed from those who do care. 

  Then they try to manifest reasons why or vaguely gaslight with "it failed, time to pack it up" and hope the devs see their thoughtless comments and agree (and probably do).


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 16:23:03
content:
  Im here to disagree and show that some of us still want it in Neos, still believe in our own decentralized currency in a metaverse, and still want respect for those people who pit their money in for years, thinking they were funding Neos, and still believe it would be a beautiful thing if those people eventually got rewarded when(if) Neos gets bigger.


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 16:28:49
content:
  The problem is that the one person who could be making such arrangements is also as present as a blue moon. The team is aware that many people have funded it via NCR, and that some people were even drawn to Neos because of it. A full removal had to be done on the Steam build, which was the primary way to get the title until they were forced to modify their professional build for normal use.
  Additionally, crypto has had a lot of negative light attached to it, is the common source of many current scams, and has a fluxuating value so unstable, it's useless in trade. This has led to many potential users from other platforms (not just VRChat) decline outright due to concerns or troubled pasts.
  Despite all that, it was proposed to create a financial API to keep it a part of Neos, and would allow other systems to be developed as well by proxy. This means NCR would be moved down to a plug-in, which may seem like a downgrade... but at this time, it's disabled for the majority of users (again, Steam Build) and for those who DO have it active... are they honestly using the parts that make it work every day? Again, NCR is so loosely tied to the platform, you can snip it off and- oh wait, it's called the Steam build.


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 16:30:20
content:
  So... I don't know about you, but a plug-in system that could potentially give NCR even more integration support, and other systems as well? Sounds like a good deal...
  Just too bad someone who isn't here 99% of the time has no interest with this path, and will feed his minions whatever they want to hear, unless it's "I want out, please send emails to a rebounding inbox."


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 16:34:20
edit_date: 2023-04-22 13:46:15
content:
  Let's be real: How the <REDACTED> did I go from almost $1200, to $22k, to now $200, in the timespan of a few months, and only having a SINGLE transaction under my belt? Who the heck would even want to try and use that as a form of payment if having even a sliver makes you magically god overnight?


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 16:36:02
content:
  So, trust in the system? Yeah, it's basically dead. Having an offering to have it available via a side system is basically as fair as it gets, and offers improvements that aren't available right now.


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 16:43:27
edit_date: 2023-04-18 03:31:18
content:
  Thats easy to answer. Because the devs went hostile against it and how can any asset not collapse when the people who are supposed to at the very least maintain it turn against their own funders for no reason? You expect crypto holders to hold onto it? The only people who are holding it are actual Neos natives. Those are the only people left that you want to throw under the bus.

  Those who've been involved in crypto know that they go through booms and busts that leave the asset higher in value pre-boom, but that that comes at the cost of aspectacle in price movement. NCR would still be higher than it was pre-boom if it wasn't for the uncertainty where the general feeling the room gets is that the devs might remove it to make people like you happy for a day.

  If you want an example, look at MANA on coinmarketcap or something, which also got a 90% drawdown woth the rest of the market, but still weeathered it 10x better than NCR did and is at a higher baseline than it was before its price boom. Thats unfortunately how markets work cycles work, if not abit more exaggerated in a VERY illiquid low-market cap coin like NCR.

  NCR did worse because of the hostility and honestly, probably illegal behavior from multiple angles.


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 16:52:05
content:
  and like I dont get it about this proposed financial API.... There's so much shit that gets "proposed" for Neos, lol. What you really mean is "devs dont want responsibility for this anymore"

  The idea that after everyone gave money to Neos they should be relegated to a mod that might happen is just insulting. It's a non-solution born from a childish mind or one that didn't know that NCR's chain could be forked and supported by Froox's team.

  If you want to just say any other currency can work in Neos then that's also bad for thr holders. What do you think would happens if a much more widely used foreign currency was set up alongside a smaller countries native currency? You'd get Argentina aka misery for everyone who has Pesos.


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 16:52:08
edit_date: 2023-04-20 12:49:47
content:
  *sigh* the devs going 'hostile' thing has been disproven so many times, I'll be blue to the face if I have to keep saying it, and everyone else is surely tired of wasting oxygen mentioning it...


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 16:53:13
edit_date: 2023-04-20 12:50:56
content:
  The devs themselves publicly said they don't want to deal with it. That kind of led people to need to aide with Karel.


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 16:54:15
content:
  I mean, they kibd of dragged their funders into the feud for no reason instead of simply saying "ncr holders have nothing to do with this internal issue. We'll continue to take care of them and support them regardless of what happens"


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 16:55:06
edit_date: 2023-04-20 12:51:10
content:
  instead they softly set it up as a us-vs-crypto situation where its implied if Karel wins they'll be okay, and if Froox wins they'll be thrown out


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 16:56:37
content:
  well, asside from the fact that uh... the "uS-vS-cRyPtO" thing was due to a certain thing called VALVE


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 16:58:21
content:
  Listen, you can talk fairy tales until pixey dust is the only remaining substance of the world, but for someone who seems to know a lot about "ThE nAtIvEs," boy you have no clue.
  Virtually everyone was excited to see Neos kick off, even if the reason was... a bit concerning. Overall, people who were long term supporters were getting their NCR to a higher value, and receiving what felt like a payoff.
  Then Karel released an announcement that was a shock to LITERALLY everyone, INCLUDING the dev team, who wasn't even aware of the important message. The only reason I even found out was thanks to an announcement made in-world by the Neos managing bot (or whatever that thing is), and it started to divide EVERYTHING from there


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 16:59:11
content:
  That was fine, its great even. Most users dont even need to see NCR if they dont want to. Shouldnt everyone already be satisfied if they don't like it?


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 17:00:47
content:
  hiding something and not being there are two different things. People are not stupid; if you hide something, it doesn't dismiss the fact it is involved. Look at Discord groups who changed administration tools all because of when they added crypto support.


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 17:01:35
content:
  The shit between Karel and Team was internal, didnt start with an annoucnement. Unless you mean the moment he hired Andrea and people felt he was trying to take reigns.


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 17:02:37
content:
  Or you mean old annoucnements where Karel was trying to "manage" NCR with annoucing and then canceling a burn. Which, fair enough, if you ask me that was the start of shit going south


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 17:04:27
content:
  Mostly the latter... that's when I definitely saw people on the platform just acting like everything turned into a funeral.


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 17:04:30
content:
  who. cares? The masses are against all sorts of things. ETH doesn't use POW anymore and just because spmething is unpopular or makes dimwits huffy doesnt make it bad. Gay marriage was reviled by most people for a long ass time, lmao


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 17:05:10
edit_date: 2023-04-17 17:06:11
content:
  Well, the *shit* between the Team and Karel started as an overreach of Karel and over-protective behaviour of the Team, clashed in a breakup caused by loss in trust and is now in a stale mate.


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 17:06:35
content:
  Well I can agree with that, that All the attempts to manage ncr with burns, buybacks, etc were bad. NCR shouldve just been left alone. Supported but no "managing" to try to raise its value. thats my belief atleast


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 17:08:44
content:
  karel's take was that he needed to actively manage and foster it. I mean maybe someone veru experienced in marketmaking couod have succceeded, but not by making annoucnements etc


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 17:09:37
content:
  More or less... and with the rate of how much minting was going on, even with adjustments, it would have been a steady progress. Sure, NCR returns from Patreon would dip but not sure how that's an issue if it is to match the value of the tier.
  I know that having the currency handle itself is what usually gives it an appeal to many. It becomes its own kindred spirit in a way.


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 17:10:12
content:
  I mean to be perfectly honest, the moment it started to go "to the moon" it was immediatly clear that it was overvalued


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 17:12:56
content:
  at the time people were saying "look at how much more advanced Neos is to something like Decentraland, and its marketcap is $X so Neos could be $XX"


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 17:13:48
edit_date: 2023-04-17 17:16:37
content:
  I could not be happier if NCR succeedes, but while i think Karel brought much to Neos in the past, expecially with his knowledge of VR and its hardware, sadly he is now a roadblock. I don't mean that in a mean way. Perhaps i am wrong and he can just give a version of neos to a group of programmer he hires to make this an amazing product, but my personal bet would be still on "the team" or an extension of that. Not because they are unquestionable better at their job, but because they really care about this, way more then a job ever does.


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 17:14:18
content:
  And in the end NCR is connected to the future of Neos or one of its products. Its the interest of the people in it.


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 17:15:36
content:
  and people who were drawn in during this time from the crypto crowd were also of a different mindset. This resulted in actual new pushes to make the system do things that no one else really bothered trying yet. I still remember the Bitcoin Museum and people trying to get the CPU scaling system to work, so that the server would expand and contract resources based on demand, a service I wasn't even familiar with and found the idea of rather neat, aside from the fact the world itself was also very well made and informative


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 17:18:09
content:
  Neos has amazing world and content created for it, but its like every time i see something it gets lost after half a year


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 17:18:57
content:
  Many people in neos like creating more then using the creations, similar to myself, how i sabotage myself in any game their is to create content for it, only for the sake of having it created.


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 17:19:16
content:
  Game allows building starships? I build the most complicated and time consuming one possible, but using it? Nah^^


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 17:20:01
content:
  I'm generally the opposite: most things I build I tend to use often... except the elliptical joystick. Less than a week, and that thing terrifies me


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 17:20:51
content:
  Its good to have a creative community while development... ... in the hopes that development continues


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 17:25:41
edit_date: 2023-04-18 03:38:14
content:
  how is Karel a roadblock? he personally secured funding for neos, allowed all of it to exist, and I suppose it costed him a lot of effor and stress. now, when neos gained traction and got stable patreon income, he can be tossed away like a piece of a trash, as he is no longer needed?


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 17:27:15
content:
  You do realize neos is like... years... in a coma... a total standstill of anything beside what happens inside neos, and thats limited since new featurs can't be developed


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 17:29:05
content:
  Neos is since years on life support because nothing can move, because not Karel OR the team can create anything without giving it to the other side, they each despise


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 17:32:23
content:
  I do realize and I know it happened when the cryptobros invaded neos and Karel was declared worlds biggest villain


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 17:32:30
content:
  The only thing that is worth the ongoing fight is the software, that noone wants to give to the other side and they both own half. Karel thinks its owned by the company, but that company is not capable of acting. And Froox thinks its his alone, because he made it, but thats obviously also not entirely true. Its a total roadblock


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 18:33:51
content:
  The reason I'm against NCR is how volatile it is. Even if it comes back, what's stopping the whole market crash from happening again? Volatility leads to uncertainty. If NCR is aiming for longevity, it *can't* be this volatile. How do you propose such a catastrophic event be prevented while NCRs management is "hands off"?


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 18:41:30
content:
  I think people confuse crypto with money. Crypto currencies are an commodity or wares. They stand for something, limited. You can't stabilize it by printing more of it or removing some from the market on demand, you can't really integrated a system the requires a stable currency. Thats why crypto has stable coins... to create a easy accessable gate between commodity and currency


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 18:46:08
content:
  At some point, if the market of a coin gets big enough, it gets more stable, but even bitcoins are not there yet, and they probably never will be. Doesn't mean its worthless. It stands for a particular idea and limited resource that can't be easily taken away from you. Its valuable as such.


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 19:00:05
content:
  I think the other issue with NCR is the same issue with all 'tokens:' they're all required to deal with ETH, another currency, just to manipulate


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 19:01:49
content:
  Because it works without trust, as in, its an actual thing that can be (mathematically) proven. While money is based on trust in an entity, a state. NCR was created at a point where the project (neos) didn't had any money. They gave out this utility coin as a thank for for supporting it and people realized that if neos has a great future, so does NCR. As such, while they developers could not give anything of value as a thank you... in case of success, the ones helping the project would be having a payback for supporting it


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 19:03:01
content:
  Similar how you can give you limited edition coinage, that are ultimatly only worth its metal, until other people want them and it is a limited commodity


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 19:07:35
content:
  The thing is, on paper, it makes sense, but in practice... eh....
  The thing is that logically speaking, people who were in Neos thought about selling, but decided to hold because the value could go up. Then when it plumetted, there then came a divide where some sold, feeling the value will never recover, and others weren't sure if they even could (again, you need ETH).
  In the end, crypto just encourages hoarding, which isn't really worthwhile if you plan to use it for any kind of exchange, especially since people's speculation of its value is what ultimately destroyed it.


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 19:08:34
content:
  The worth of these mathematically proven coins can and do change on an exponential scale, for a project like neos that needs longevity in its worth that seems like really bad tides.


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 19:10:49
content:
  You can think about crypto currency both ways. I mean there is no such big difference between an ingame currency and a crypto currency... short of that the ingame currency is not actually tengiable


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 19:11:38
content:
  I think that also highlights the bigger divide as well: NCR was to be a reward token, a payoff as thanks for supporting the platform's development.
  Then Karel wanted to burn its remaining mint to get on exchanges more quickly, or hold stakes to improve longlasting values... he wanted NCR to become a currency and no longer a token of generosity.
  So, yes, NCR was a happy little token of Thanks. Then it wasn't. I mean, look at all the lemmings of this chat going "MOOON? NCR ON DEEX WHEN? VALUE SUX, WANT UPS NOWZ. LOST ALL DA MONEYS"


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 19:11:40
content:
  In its most basic form no mather if ingame currency or crypto currency, it will be horded and speculated on.


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 19:15:15
content:
  But the reason that, for a game, an ingame currency can still be an advantage, is that you can make it stable. Stable coins for example work by giving out as much tokens as the stabilized currency is hold back in exchange. In pure theory, if you get a stable coin $ its backed by a real $.


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 19:16:10
content:
  NCR is nothing like that, it is limited in its amount what makes it worth it and has a system of getting "generated" or really just diseminated


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 19:16:48
content:
  If the owners of neos would give out 1 for... 1$ each, that could work or suddenly every single coin be gone and they could not give out coins anymore


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 19:17:22
content:
  So its limited nature is the worth, but also why it would have great problems as an actual ingame currency. So it will stay a commodity


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 19:23:01
content:
  Or, better yet...

  Just accept NCR is dead. It is gone. It is deceased. It is no longer of this world.

  And trying to fluff up stories and concepts and "Look at the pretty graphs" is going to fix anythign about it.
  The whole reliance on a system that is reliant on another system thing isn't holding itself up very well, not a day goes by that crypto isn't the butt-end of a joke, and while it COULD have all worked, based on concepts and ideas, the human element basically showed how much it didn't.

  If you use a stablecoin system, sure, it'll be effectively locked to a known value. But at the same time... do you really need to be using a blockchain system at that point? Sure, you could run in a federated state, which would keep performance costs FAR lower, but then again... you could just use a simple database... like everyone else...

  If people really want a crypto version of Neos that badly, having an option to still use it has always been on the table. But everyone just wants ALL the way or NO way, and some people want MONEY or VALUABLE ASSETS. You can't have both, only something in the middle.


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 19:25:23
content:
  In the end it doesn't mather that much. Again, crypto isn't the reason why neos is in a coma. The only reason are two people in this world, there is nothing outside of that. If they finally decide how to split up, all of that stuff will fall into place. Its really the small stuff.


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 19:27:01
content:
  And I love how every cryptojabrony keeps dodging the taxes situation. The US government views it as AN INVESTMENT, as basically GAMBLING, and it's a system that is on top of another system, and I don't even want to think on how you handle a stock that, in itself, costs OTHER KINDS OF STOCK to even manipulate and move. How the HECK does that work when I report on my taxes? "Hi, yes, I made $50, but it cost me $25 just to sell it to make $50, which I received back when it was worth $10. Is that a gain of $40 or $15?"


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 19:29:57
content:
  you can prove how much money you payed in or what resources you used, and how much everything you have now is worth, and you pay taxes on the simple difference


type: message
date: 2023-04-17 19:41:00
content:
  What i wanted to say, and was lost because of NoPig... lets PRETEND the code of neos is no longer valuable for one side after all this time. Lets say froox, that did write most of the code, made a redo and new version of his vision. Just because you did take 10 years the first time around doesn't mean you need that time again if you already know how it works. Most of the works in neos is based on the knowledge on how it works, less the amount of lines of code. So pretend he did rewrite a new version of neos and says "f... it".
  Is the name neos really what made it worth it? Or anything that neos is now for that mather? Or is it about the CEO of neos and keeping it running? The crypto currency? No, in the end that all doesn't mather


