some people just want the facts

well, i would not overdo it anyway. Its just so you have a tether to the one explaining it to you

just.... not the ubisoft "XBOX CONTROLLAH DIAGRAM"

postal 2 tutorial in neos???

Don't forget the rocky road

All that said, i would not invest my time into it, until i have seen the license system.

agreed.

Don't get me wrong, but words are cheap. To see an actual change of client and server applications by programmers of karel would actually make me believe that he has the intention of continuing this project

And thats even more important than the license system itself.

welp, as previously explained, 2 weeks, with a possible additional 2 weeks if things get messed up.

What would the cons of continued development via official plugin be?

We talked about this before, but can't you yourself think of nothing? I mean just on the top of your head?

using search function

Beside the fact that this is beta software, unfinished and many of the core applications already outdated (like unity implementation or even rendering and kind of totally missing physics engine)

This is just a horrible idea in general, as it means you can't ever fix issues that arise from core-code

And you obviously also get to the point where your changes outgrow what the core code was intended for, creating endless hours of workarounds that break with other featurs and plugins integrated

Its like building the third floor of a house without the ability to ever touch whats under it

And living only in the third floor from now on

I think I either missed your last reply or either forgot about it - thanks for the previous and current explanation.
You could patch core problems with extreme HarmonyLib usage, but that's honestly hellish
I see what's wrong with it

Maybe it was on discord, my apology

I just mean making it fancy, sure we can have out tiny basic shop with just buy/sell and nothing else

I personally think its way more important to have THAT licensing system in the game as a first step. You can sell license keys on a website with fancy youtube videos and a cheap online shop if you have to, but without the core implementation of that licensing system, it all breaks down. Dead on arrival.

If you want to make this easy and cheap ingame, and still working great, you could just make a public folder with all the items that can be sold. Everyone can see them there in their own inventory, but they are not usable/spawnable without that license, so its giving perfect access to it and the buyer. If you have an ingame shop later, its still there as a backup solution and for people to search around

And it could extend to the point where people just have their products in their public folders

What i mean is... building on that license system is easy and there are multiple solutions for shops. Websites, ingame worlds, public folders or a full blown shop-interface. But if that license system doesn't work/exist, its all for nothing.

I'd probably dive on it if I wasn't using the steam version xD

Why can't you use it? Keep it and gift space to new people ;)

I'll be rich!

YEY!

Update for the people following the chronicle of Sloppy’s storage issues: got refunded for 600 of the 1200 NCR I spent, I immediately re-spent the 600 to try again to get the intended result as NCR holds no use outside of storage rental for me, and the system worked as intended this time. It properly extended and I have my 50GB for 4 years. 🥳

I still have another year of storage with my NCR amount. Hopefully I don't have to deal with that headache by then.

None

None

Karel @malooniac just re-pinging about this question

Hello ☺️ apologies it must have get lost in the thread.

Groups are a Neos Pro feature that require purchasing a commercial licence.

If you would like to discuss your needs please email us on hello@neos.com and we can take it from there ☺️ Thank you 🙏

Aren’t groups also available to neos Patreon users at architect tier?

It is. It is not a Pro license only function

Yeah, I have my own

not to mention... Neos Pro isn't even on the website anymore.

And as far as I remember, Karel said aswell that Neos Pro isnt activly sold anymore?

I wish I could get more storage for my group but alas I don’t think there is a way

I completly forgot to setup a group back then

Yup, here we go: Wiki has an entire page regarding groups:
"Groups can currently only be created by Neos Patreons. It requires at minimum the Architect tier to create one group.
To create a group the official points of contact are to send an email to hello@neos.com, or sending a message to its Telegram with your request."

None

Hello all. I just joined the patreon at the $6 tier. I was wondering how I go about getting the storage added to my account and the badge saying I'm a patron.

Has this patreon reward changed @malooniac ? It is also still there on the Patreon tier.

rewards apply on the 1st of each month, an if they have not applied by the 2nd, contact support at hello@neos.com

How do I go about linking it to my neos account? Or will it automatically apply?

Ah, that you would have to actually email, it used to be handled by an user in the discord but... Since Karel decided to call them un-official and impostors... they have stopped giving tech support in fear of legal action by karel

so

Good Luck, I have only seen two people here say they have managed to get in contact with the Team through the email.

others just havent said anything

Oh lovely

Oh fek you

Well, from the previous long tweet of Karel he definitely said he isnt gonna work for solirax as passionate as before. I think they will need to hire some more people that will do customer support or somethin

OR

OR

JUST REINSTATE THE SUPPORT TEAM FROM THE DISCORD

WHO WERE DOING IT FOR FREEEEEEE

Nah

Wait... does that mean the community moderation team is no longer official?

if so, then they cant take moderation action outside the discord,

I dont doubt Karel's new team (who we dont know who they are to my knowledge) are working on things, I just have seen an noticable LACK of evidence showing they actually are

Well I would think that as long as they have a role ingame - they can moderate

Yeeeah, but, just give it a little tiny bitty more time. Everything will make sense soon enough

Yes, but if the "team" who were providing free (unpaid) support, had instated them, then they were called impostors and unofficial... that means by a technicality, all of their actions are unofficial

I think only the discord server was been called unofficial

Nope, karel outright said that the "neos team" on the discord were impostors and are not the neos team

This exact message actually

Oh, wait, guess who is still in the discord, and has the exact same role as the rest of the "impostor team"

Technically he's not wrong. Froox is retired so he cant really call anyone a neos team? Its just a Discord Quirk they decided to use to show a bit of hierarcy in the community

Can I message you privately here or on discord?

Ofc

But yeah, no doubt Karel is going to see this chat, so I just ask that You (Karel) dont go after the moderation team, its basically the only thing thats keeping Neos from becoming anarcy

So, guessing the best way is still for me to go through the email in regards to applying it? Sorry, I'm not the best with this kinda stuff.

Yeah

And guessing in that email I just give my account name and the patreon name?

yeah basically

Patreon Email, Neos Email, Neos Username, Patreon Tier

Hello Ruka I have found an user “Ruka” on our Patreon however it has a different tier and no corresponding Neos Account with that email. Details on your accounts to connect them would be appreciated either in DM or at hello@neos.com.

My username on there is Dante_Maxwell

Certainly not free contractors used to send invoices monthly until the strike.

Ahh, They were still providing support to the players even after the fact however,

Thank you, your Neos Account storage was increased to 25 GB

Awesome, thank you so much :3

Thank you for supporting Neos, we couldn’t run the cloud without awesome Patrons like yourself 🙏❤️

None

I think we don’t have a system for that yet. Pretty sure no one would abuse that.

None

Meowdy @Zgrate!

Hello!

hello all ^^

mowh-

Howdy UwU

For a second I thought there must've been a chain of people saying "Howdy UwU" because of the out of chat telegram preview & your name

lmao

The pump and dump groups surfing on the Meta hype are solely responsible for the up and downs of that curve. Those groups exist and they did that to NCR as well to other tokens of metaverses during that time

It's sad that the buy backs actually went into the pockets of those groups

Any specific reason why the wiki is being messed with, specifically https://wiki.neosvr.com/Office_Hours being completely scorched earth?

Looks like karel has been busy

He also removed info that also states that uh, crypto could be, ILLEGAL in some places

I unfortunately can't assume good faith anymore

Removing information about the discord and neos team it seems, a bit of cleaning

I checked recent changes

There is wayyyy more

yeah im scrollin through it

https://wiki.neosvr.com/Special:Contributions/Karel

Half the wiki is just gone, he wonders why the community has issues with him example A

Although there were a number of pages and content deleted, I wouldn't go as far as to say half the wiki. There is still an abundance of pages related to components, logix, user guides, controller bindings, Avatar setup and IK etc that are still available and not modified.

(Not agreeing with the deletions, just commenting on the half the wiki statement)

I have not seen any changes, because i simply have not looked into the wiki, but that doesn't seam the point of critic of people. The deleted Informations are about external help, office hours, contributions and other critical themes (if what is listed here is true). So this is more about trust.

slight overreaction on my part and I apologize for that, im pissed off

No worries, I definitely understand and that frustration is shared with me as well.

i'll rephrase, the office hours with all the useful questions and answers for the past few years, audio and transcriptions are gone, along with some other pages

I hope he's ready to replace the lost services then. Otherwise, this is purposefully making an inferior product.

I'm also noticing some translations gone?

I assume Karel made these changes strategically or in preparation for something and not in spite for spite's sake. Karel and @malooniac, since everyone is curious about the visible changes being made to the wiki, would you be able to comment on anything at this time in regards to the changes?

I think that's because the Neos Team was renamed to Neos Foundation and thus the translations are now inaccurate

https://wiki.neosvr.com/Neos_Foundation

afaik translations are automatic

Ah okay (and cool)

I am sure Karel will fix it in time. Wiki has a lot of content.

Just a preparation for the main update, there will be more info including awards available. Thank you for your understanding and patience. 🙏

Thanks for the details, so more updates are expected to the Wiki soon so folks should be aware that more changes are coming?

In terms of a new whitepaper, details on Neos Foundation, the awards and details on staking for sure.

It’s taking some time but it will be worth it.

So, any detail about the actual neos development? Like the expected shop/features/continued development in general?

Will there be any changes to the Moderation ticket system and their now "unofficial" team?

What do you mean by awards in this context? Feels like a strange time to use that word.

Oh yea, speaking of. Perhaps considering that there is no Moderation anymore for ingame Neos. Could you perhaps add information to the future of ingame moderation / support related to the product neos itself?

I think the Moderation team is doing good job, didn’t have many complaints so far. Very glad for their work. We should definitely do some award for them as well. Some of them got CDCT>NCR but not all.

Nah looks like Karel is chill with the mods

That's at least good 👍

The mods do good work

Are they still allowed to take action if it's required such as bans and whatnot, in the same way as they were before?

Awards in terms of paying people very publicly for their great work. Paying people privately didn’t work too well.

Also much more open so anyone can participate.

The mods do good work but it would particular good to have the mods organized in some sort of official channel or capacity. If the Discord is unofficial now, what would the place be to meet Neos moderation in the future?

(or to contact them at all?)

Oh I just saw it on the wiki, mods are canon

Cool

Mods as in moderators

Are we still on track for the new system?

As mods are doing great job it seems to me now I think no changes are immediately necessary. Having more frequent communication would be great and I’m sure we’ll get there over time.

So what's up with listing people who have never heard of it as part of the foundation?

For sure, we’re days away I think.

I don’t consider them part of the Foundation yet but would love for that to happen down the line.

Well, great. It will make such a huge impact on peoples feeling of progress, related to neos, if we would see ANY code change. Seeing Neos updated in some capacity or feature added would really show that Neos has a future in your hands.

Just wanted to keep them some official status on the wiki as they are an important part of day to day operations and important part of Neos users having a great experience on the playform.

Thank you for the added details, much appreciated!

Karel where the hell was i a vandel

i undid a page blank

you did, with NO explation

if you blank a page, at least give a reason for it

Neos Wiki is not a place to post personal blog posts, reverting changes done by me is considered vandalizing, also does your nickname say fuck crypto? Thats wild

rahter then jummping right to a ban

it was not a blog post

it was a LOG of a office hours

in its own namespace ffs.

What office?

oh boy, don't go there

Mine

:)

Office Hours are a common company practice, especially with smaller groups, that allow public communication with said group, often gaining insight about possible areas of improvement and to help build trust with the community

You don’t have an office with Neos plese post your stuff on your personal website or elsewhere not on the official Neos Wiki

...there's... no need for a physical location... this is 2023... it's a term, not a literal breakdown of nouns...

(Though, a physical office hour would be neat)

That's somewhat against the goals of the wiki itself Karel. It is disappointing but your call. I'll remove all my content if you want. 90% of the wiki will be empty though.

ProbablePrime is not a part of our company

please tell me why im banned from Neos

wait, it resulted in a ban on the platform? Those systems are linked that much?

The Neos Account that did the vandalism was suspended

Welp. I guess the Wiki will be empty.... sad

You are allowed to contribute, just not personal blog posts and tons of audio files making backups more difficult

....they aren't... even stored on the wiki...

I'm sorry I'll be pulling my content as it's not part of the company.

but whatever

but a ban from wiki access shouldn't lead to a ban on the platform. That's way over the line

^

not even a warning, a ticket, an email

I just gotta turn my power back on I was fighting a light switch.

^

you have my sympathies.

Both the wiki and Neos Cloud use the same accounts

no system to prevent an account from just editing a wiki?

So ban access to the wiki, not their account. You outright just banned a user over a mouse click.

there is

its called the wikimeida block system

no reason to have them linked

especially an indefinite ban, I might add. Over a SINGLE edit.

The user knew very well that he is vandalazing s change done by the CEO would do damage elsewhere as well

no karel, they didn't know

that's what a WARNING is for

No one knew.

We have unified accounts so people dont have to make a separate one for Wiki

that's neat, but a ban from a wiki should not result in a no warning ban from the game

Its not a ban from the wiki

its a block yes.

ban, block, whatever

i know the termanogogly

It’s suspension of the Neos Account that vandalized the Wiki

Why did you revert the change?

becasue

you did not explain why it was done

Then why does the Wiki claims to be a "Community Project"?

you just. blanked the page

https://wiki.neos.com/Wiki_Contributions_%26_Translations

that can be done in error quite easuly

you wiped valuable information from a wiki with no reason, people were rightfully pissed and used THEIR rights to undo it

i have seen it a few times in my time doing countervandlim on en.wiki

Because people from the community can contribute

well, they contributed to a possible mistake. You punished them.

"Please edit away!" - ...

a warning my man, would have a better outcome than the nuclear button

The account can be reactivated if there is an explanation by the user, this is a warning

Usually warnings are warnings and bans are bans

no, this is shooting someone in the arm for merely sneezing at you, a warning is "please don't do it again, doing so will get you a suspension"

That would be deleting the account

you didn't make a warning. it's INDEFINITE.

"with an expiration time of indefinite (account creation disabled) (vandalizing and spamming)"

A warning shot to the chest

Welp, like a blockchain, all actions are publicly visible on a wiki. So we're all going to keep watching... and if something changes... we'll know...

https://wiki.neosvr.com/Special:BlockList

Probably good to set up some wiki rules. Is undoing or changing anything the CEO does on the wiki always going to be considered a bannable offense?

"Everyone regardless of their status in Neos can edit the wiki."
Hmm....

I always had this idea that wikis were basically community run and managed. This monarch style is a little new to me

None

this is a little low and screwed up, even for him

Neos Wiki is official Neos wiki run and hosted by Solirax, there are many such wikis. It’s not wikipedia.org just uses the same engine

You are side stepping the primary issue... but if you want the wiki to no longer be updated by the community, as represented by your actions... then just say so.

None

Banning someone over it is 100% over the line.

oof

and the people joining? They have to now witness the results of your actions...

Oh ive been like 2nd hand seeing all of this

Also yes hi welcome new people

helloooo

I have stayed out of this group for like all the correct reasons but let see where this goes

lmao

Currently anyone logged in can edit though right? It might be good to set up some DOs and DO NOT DOs so people don't step on toes. Not knowing what you can and can't do as a collaborator seems very important.

Revertimg other people changes, especially of the company management is of course not alowed.

Karel did you remove Flame?

yes he did

I would like confirmation from Karel just in case.

Anyone spreading FUD in this group will be banned

if he did get banned i dont see why he did, i dont think he said anything remotely bad

whats fud?

fear uncertainty doubt

Is that like a form of blackmail?

Banning dissent and undoing community changes if they go against you looks very bad for any kind of leader.

For which message did he get banned?

Good point

Neos is a project with crypto called Neos Credits, manipulation trough FUD is not allowed and not good for NCR holders

How is this relevant?

bruh

Please make a separate Telegram group and post FUD there

Is commenting negatively about the CEO because members of the community disagree with his actions considered FUD?

^

Was Flames' fud message deleted? Everything prior hasn't been crypto orientated, just wiki concerns.

Criticism is Fud I guess?

xD

correct i guess

Fud is fud

Duh

fud about wiki is fud about crypto?

Fud relating to Neos in general

is this a yes then Karel ?

Doesn’t matter what part it’s all interconnected with one brand

So any material in which neos is painting in a negative/critiqued is FUD?

Any part of neos and its various adventures

None

Are we only allowed to praise you and the brand then?

If you mean by painting being overly negative and dramatic then yes

"overly" might need defining

You are allowed to do that 🫶

I feel negatively about your recent decisions. Am I FUD? Or is there room for discussion?

But sometimes something can be "overly negative" if that part of the product is widely renown for being a poor part of it?

Constructive criticizm without drama is also welcome

None

All criticism is dramatic to a degree, someone will always disagree with someone critique.

I don't like drama either

But thats what Flame was basicly doing.

OOOO cant do that, thats FUD

get him officer

Shit you right

wow. smh edited.

I feel that it was still constructive, any criticism is going to be negative no matter how constructive it is.

^^

It was also like, very unclear and much more of a question being asked instead of criticism

Imagine for a minute holding some NCR and caring about its price. You certainly wouldn’t want to be dramatic and decrease its price. If there is a problem please get in touch with us. No public drama necessary.

Karel, it's sad to say but I have no words of praise for you anymore…

A lot of us have NCR still, some of us have heavily regreted to recommend it to friends aswell.

Right. I do hold ncr and realistically if i want the price to rise i would want to give criticism on a product because yes, at the time of critique, it would decrease but when the product is developed further and people see more promise in the product wouldnt the price also increase with the quality of the product being further wildly renown?

I'm still holding my tokens no matter what happens, even if something petty is said by someone in the community. But seeing staff banning someone because they edited a page on a public and important community resource is a little out of touch.

Yes and all because unnecesary public drama, thats exactly what a project with crypto shouldnt do

but how will the project ever get better?

if an issue is big enough its always gonna be public drama.

If it shouldn't host public drama then why is it what Neos is now famously known for?

Companies need to be able to be held publicly accountable.

It would be good to have messages responsible for a ban visible to at least some sort of moderation team (or to the community), rather than it being ambiguous what exactly got a user banned.

Agreed.

If the old "Unofficial" team would truly stop supporting Neos, Neos wont work.

Or even just a direct answer

Because my co-founder decided to start a crazy public drama that is good not sure for whom

the cat was already out the hat before your ex business partner said anything.

Personally if your product can't stand criticism it doesn't deserve customers.

And what about the multiple times you did something bad? Which also a lot of Whales back then criticized? To a point they startet to activly warn others? And this isnt FUD.... there were several Twitter Posts aswell from them back then.

I've no familiarity with your co-founder or the Neos community before mid-2022, but everything causing drama that I've seen seems to be a recent development

I personally would like to know which of Flame's messages were responsible for his removal. I did not notice anything egregious during this conversation but it's possible I may have not seen it? It would be good to know exactly what sorts of messages constitute removal.

Yes whales that wanted me to buy back their NCR for mint prices and I explained that they need to sell on public markets because it wouldnt be fair to other holders and that we are going to support prices for as long a we can but just in open marketplaces

But... you did buyback a lot and those were actually against buybacks too in their Posts.

I did buybacks on Uniswap

Yes after that you get criticized on everything

For which message exactly did Flame end up being banned?

lol

When the price is up youre the smartest person alive and when its down youre the villain

60

If you're aware of this why do you take criticism so harshly?

Also a very true point

This...

Flame was spreading fud long term, today there were panicky messeges about new users seeing some bad things. What users were seeing were his panicky messages. Prime examlple of creating drama, fear and doubt.

Constructive criticizm is okay, fud harming our crypto is not.

So you banned one of your most creative and best users for being worried.

Thats not what he was posting.

well karel, atleast we are at starting mint price, so we can get to 9$ again :)

wait we going with a snapshot ?

It was once on 14$ on minting I think

Daaaamn it fell lmao

I have someone who accidently bought at 10$ because the payment took multiple days for some reason...

The price was calculated at the time of doing the mint, processing is what took multiple days that didn’t affect the price

What was on the website at the time of doing the transaction that was what was processed.

It was around 5$ as far as I remember, but the Processing of sending eth and receiving it took so damn long for some reason.

If he was panicking then I'd call him a victim of FUD, not someone who spreads it - maybe addressing concerns instead of silencing them might be a better tact

That was learning money for the person to never touch crypto again after that.

I'm all about the engine, I actually make games and content for users within the engine. I was there in the very early days of it. I wouldn't want my whole history to be erased over a mishap with the community wiki.

NCR was never mined it was only minted. Thank you very much for your generosity sponsoring MMC. 🙏

That process is minting

I'm pretty sure that whole thing above was a typo (Oh oops!)

Thats what he originally said.

Yes ETH is mined and can be used to mint NCR. 👍 I remember some confusion of people who thought Neos client is doing actual mining.

Calling crypto shady are you trying to get banned? 😂

None

Why would he be banned, he just personally finds crypto shady in the sense of his actual bank.

Maybe it will get you some clout on Discord dunno.

??

I mean crypto can def be a little shady. Something about answering to no-one. Always has its perks and its hmmmm

Calling crypto shady is definitely fud in a group about a project with crypto 😄

we need ingame virtual crypto mines, with virtual pickaxes & NCR ore
1 token per swing

Neos putting people to work in the mines

holy shit i cant wait to be like the musk families emerald miners!

Honestly it's crypto traders online who always seem shady? I've always been a bit turned off when I wander into crypto sides of Twitter. Between constant scams and obv weird purchases of poor quality art I think I just don't like the way it absorbs everything they do or talk about. Unhealthy imo

Rule number 1) In this group crypto isn’t shady.

Alot of message today, is there white paper?

No, only several Bans

Same status as last time, methinks

Crypto's got a bad rep, which is funny considering it's supposed to just be a cool technology
human moment

Several?

Several?

Just drama, no paper sadly

Is there short version of messages

nah g gotta go through the sludge

I... think 2 from Wiki/Neos and around 4 people out of this chat?
There is no transparency in here sadly.

bog business

Karel made wiki edits
A user undid them and got banned from neos
Another user got banned from this chat for FUD
No new whitepaper

The swamps

Oh and probableprime is no longer canon. You hate to see it

😔

🧀

White paper soon one day

unfortunate day for the soldiers on the front like

Always soon

🧀

🧀

🧀

🧀

the Tribute to Prime

i got chu fam
https://imgur.com/a/43ITFqW

FINALLY WHITE PAPER

Very fast thank you

no problem c:

You’re the best 😙😙

see karel you should hire me im doing a great job unifying people together

None

Cheese delivery 😍😍😍

mmmm

:D

yum :D

Yeeeey 🥰

🍾

Let’s throw a party 🎉 🎈🥳

None

Psssssshhhh guys lets get some fud!

i mean food

This is kind of scary? If I'm understanding right, expressing doubts or concerns or even just a certain opinion about a part of the project can get you banned from talking about the project on any official communication platform if the CEO deems it could hurt his financial gains. Is that correct? And moreso this is the case even as a normal community member expressing their opinion in a public area, not even as a staff member on contract or anything.

1984

Another one banned without a warning.
I think.

Eojii is gone

None

Eojii has been executed

What a sad, sad day for the official Neos Telegram chat

The blue dog man is gone

Not my gains but NCR holders, any project with crypto wouldnt tolerate that

He burned short, but brightly

Probably why people think crypto is shady.

People who ban dissent in public forums are shady

Generally anyways

Plenty people love crypto see coinmarketcap.com

I mean yeah, people love money

Nothing new there

But the love of money pretty universally leads to horrible things if left unchecked? Like that's been the case forever.

The Neos community that still holds the token (Hi!) isn't going to dump it all because they heard a single thing from the community still. People aren't that sensitive.
What people are sensitive about though is getting completely silenced from official sources by having a differing opinion.

Not having any warnings or any way to apply to a ban appeal after is very not serious.

I'm also an NCR holder 👍

Aah yes, Banning big ncr holders too.

None

(By a technicality anyways)

Yes thats why fud price manipulations are not allowed

I've got a decent amount as well

I agree with your words, but I think we might have opposite opinions on what they mean.

Guys if you hold NCR lets act like it and support the project and help it prosper

Criticism can be a form of support.

Not if its all you do mix it with plenty drama and over do it

Yes some constructive criticizm is good but not weaponized

Karel, I've got a user that asked me to send a message they've sent emails to hello@neos.com about telegram moderation abuse and they haven't heard anything back... Is there anywhere better they should go to contact you?

We were trying for a long while, but a lot of your actions made us lost it...

I do - I'd love to be able to make a good amount of money off of NCR and have it be successful, but currently all I see is dedicated Neos members and NCR holders being banned for petty reasons from the only "official" public communication with the company

I personally were still "Hoping" until 1$

Yeah, that is called "Feedback" and it's very useful in a lot of cases. Every software you see has a button to send it. In the case of Neos, it's basically non-existent and the only place to share it is here.

Would you call my Feedback weaponized if I'm trying to rationalize the seriousness of the situation and how actions you take against people "causing a stirr" in the community actively harms it?

That night, you were doing some changes again and everyone were very quickly selling then.

Neos is a platform unlike any other. It has had lots of positive effects on many. The Neos Foundation would hopefully like to keep these positive effects going, so hopefully one of the things that the Foundation will do is take care of the community to the best of their ability. As long as the Foundation keeps powering through the outside forces, I'm sure some people will appreciate it.

None

Weaponized is in the eye of the beholder, perhaps. I feel as though I need to make my points and questions very clear and direct when it comes to any form of argument, especially when I believe decisions made might have grander consequences, and that directness can come across as very harsh.

god i want to see this project grow, there's nothing like it (programmatically speaking.)
But with no updates & lack of source code implying there will never be updates, we're just stuck waiting here.
The coin wont grow if the game doesn't start growing soon, all i want is hard confirmation that the source code problem has been resolved somehow.

Shout out to all our viewers out there

My only interest is the health of the community. Nothing else matters to me.

I create stuff frequently within the engine, and having the infostructure and cloud storage scaled down and slightly sideways makes me weary over the amount of time I put into my works.
I would love to see the game grow and an in-game marketplace to be compensated for the stuff I make.
But it becomes hard to work on the things I love when I have to deal with my stuff not syncing or authentication not going through. Sometimes the network will be entirely down. (I wasn't able to even open worlds for a full day because the world browser was mangled) This is current Neos, and it's a little hard to live happily in the game with everything going down.

This isn't Fud, this is just the current situation from my angle, a person who dedicated a loyal six years of my own life to this platform. It's quite unhealthy right now, and having to be constantly silenced and resources revoked from those in the community. Ignored when there's a boatload of issues within the game and within the community. It breaks my heart to see it all like this.

This place lacks quite a lot of maturity from all sides of the conversation.

Karel I have gone over everything from last night to now, you are what is causing FUD, your actions are beyond reasonable and show an distinct lack of knowledge of what you are doing

From my understanding, Froox and his team were the technical side and you were the buisness and marketing, you are attempting to work on things with zero understanding of how it is supposed to tie in and have demonstrated an extreme immaturity.

I am cancelling my Patreon Subscription until you can show an shred of maturity

I really, really want to support neos, but banning someone for undoing a change that couldve easily been accidental on your part (since no description/reason for change was presented), is over the line

I am willing to work with you, maybe even advise you on what would be better for the community,

Neos is an Creative Social Platform,

the Community is the litteral HEART AND SOUL of the project, without it, you have literally nothing but crypto-bro yes-men to dig the hole to the core of the planet and burn it into nothing

you need to consider the opinions of everyone involved, even if they may not like or agree with your stances on crypto (I personally am opposed only for environmental concerns due to power usage),

What... happend?

Neos, is bigger than you seem to understand Karel, Neos is built on the backs of everyone who has ever joined and had fun, learned the tools, and created something in the game/engine that impacted another user, positively or negatively.

You appear to be ignoring that portion of the community and are instead only focusing on the Crypto-Bro's

I was gone for like 3 hours and someone burned the house down.

User got banned from the wiki (and therefore Neos) because they undid a change Karel made on the wiki that couldve easily been an accident by Karel, and karel wont admit they were wrong and should've left a warning instead

Who, in their right mind, would ban a neos account for a wiki change? How is that related? What happend?

It's automated

They use the same account.

Yea... but if i ban someone from my world in neos, he is not banned from logging in into neos. How is that related?

SSO login

Thats completly different privileges

But rather than warn, or even place more targeted restrictions Karel suspended the account indefinitely

like the "sign in with google"

Yes, but SSO is obviously related to privileges, the privileges you give an SSO login can be changed

Otherwise everyone would have admin privileges on the platform

You can just remove the wiki privileges or limit them to read only. How is that related to a ban from Neos?

I don't care about the money, I just want a platform to exist on. You've seen how much money Patreon can give to support the whole thing? Right now it seems like everyone is obsessing over the concept of you want to turn it into the next Gumroad instead of trying to resolve what ties have been broken in the past. And uh, it's gonna be very difficult to deliver those promises if the main one developing the game is gone. All I can see is just a website with pictures and promises. Neos was different from all the Metaverse Crypto projects out there, because we actually had a thing to show. But instead it turned into one of the generic ones without anything to really show for itself other than ideas.

Karel Listen,

I want to help you make Neos succeed, I want to see it thrive, but that requires work on your part to be willing to work with others who may not share the same opinions with you, I am not asking for an apology here, I am merely asking for you to sit down, and contemplate this, to focus on what the PEOPLE want,

Every single time in history where a leader places themselves over others, their empire/rule has always fallen, this is one of the few things American schooling has successfully taught me,

You need to take a step back and really think about your actions, you saw the uproar people had here over LakesideMiners being banned over an simple change that could've EASILY been an accidental change,

Again, I don't want an apology, I want you to improve yourself so that you may be better suited to be CEO,

Fire me an message here on Telegram, I want to help, and I want to discuss *how* I can help.

What does fud mean?

short for food

I hold NCR, quite an amount, but WTF did I just see in this chat?!

"Acronym of fear, uncertainty, and doubt, a marketing strategy involving the spread of worrisome information about a competing product."

except in this case, there is no competing product currently

why is a marketing strategy being brought up though?

The wiki being "vandalized" by removing valuable information and when a concerned user tried to recover it they got banned. That doesn't look good.
That is drama. That should not happen

None

Hello, cheesed to meet you

*in Mr. Krabs voice* Money!

Money is nice, but you know what is better? That’s right, cheese

🧀

I agree. I like to spend my money on cheese and cheese accessories.

I do love me some parmesan

so that's what the C in NCR stands for

Pecorino is nice

I like blue cheese

Pepper jack

Muenster

Yess

ü

I like dousing my bolognese with parmesan
Like how a milo should be 10% milk 90% milo, as god intended

Calling the criticism weaponised is flippantly downplaying the communities concerns so you don't have to listen to us *at best*.

None

Because the removal of users in this chat is supposedly done in order to directly or indirectly prevent potential loss of product value.

Roughly the equivalent of a restaraunt chain removing you from their public group chat because you left a bad review.

More like banning your phone number from calling, but you can still eat at the restaurant

Ahh, yes, that shows the issue at hand really well. Remove bad reviews instead of using the reviews to better the restaurant

But if your food was spoiled, good luck

However it isn't the users here that cause loss of product value

If it were harassment of the CEO directly, I could see it being bannable ot at least warning/punishable. I don't want to see the CEO of a restaurant chain getting personally dragged through the mud on a restaraunt comment section just for being himself. I think that's inappropriate. And I think that when it comes to the Karel harassment as well when it isn't actually relevant. But if the restaraunt CEO puts out an official notice stating that a core popular ingredient will no longer be served, publicly bans the use of condiments, or announces his plans to destroy kitchens to make way for flashier "we're open" signs, I think criticism of those actions are more than warranted, EVEN IF the CEO in question thinks such comments might hurt the value of his products, and even if personally his feelings are hurt by the commentary. Community/public input is important, ESPECIALLY when it comes to socially or publically oriented services and products like Neos.

Constructive criticism isn't seen as such, which is sad

Good products tend to hold up to "FUD" anyway
FUD in this case seemingly being vaguely defined as whatever Karel dislikes
If he just set out some clear guidelines as to what is and isn't FUD, most people would follow them
Rather than assume it's self-evident

🧀

So true breastie

Well, let's crack the definition of FUD then. It is about statements that create fear, uncertainty and doubt. I wonder if that also applies to statements that comment on actions that cause fear, uncertainty and doubt.

In crypto, FUD is usually used to make paper hands sell quickly to make the value of a coin drop

Okay, so like half a decade of community wiki work got deleted with no notice. Why should we contribute to anything under this new management if that is how they decide to value community contributions?

A guideline for defining what FUD is would certainly rid of doubt and fear of participating in the chat.
And as a neat side effect also add value

And after all of this "FUD" we haven't seen the value drop significantly

The Patreon seems to be on the steady decline it has been since EAC

I'd respect his concerns more if there were some evidence of the impact of people's frustrations, concerns and disagreements about Neos itself on the value of NCR